Author Topic: question on acclaimed contradiction  (Read 1040 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline H.

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • View Profile
question on acclaimed contradiction
« on: October 24, 2017, 03:44:51 PM »
assalamu alaikum

i have a question on a contradiction that is claimed to be in the quran

the 2 verses in question are:

quran 38;71-2, [So mention] when your Lord said to the angels, "Indeed, I am going to create a human being from clay. So when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration."

and quran 15:28-29: And [mention, O Muhammad], when your Lord said to the angels, "I will create a human being out of clay from an altered black mud. And when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration."

so it is obviously speaking about the very same event

however the claimed contradiction lies in what did allah say to the angels. because quran 38:71-72 allah didnt mention the altered black mud part
however quran 15 does include the part of the altered black mud.

so whcih of the two did allah swt say to the angels. because now it seems contradictory. did allah say to the angels i will create from clay, or did he say i will create from clay from altered black mud

because these 2 verses are direct quotes of what allah said. and it is speaking of the same event. so what did allah say to the angels and is it not a contradiction

the person who presented the acclaimed contradiction also included the following example:

If I was to tell you today that Neil Armstrong said these famous words as he stepped on to the moon's surface:
"That's one small step for man, but one giant leap for mankind"
Two days later, I say these words were:
"That's one small step for a human, but one giant leap for humanity"
It's recounting what was said. The content of the statements are not contradicting, but it is a contradiction of quotation. He said either the first, the second, or neither. He can't have said both those sentences as he stepped onto the moon.




Offline Sama

  • Hero Member
  • *****
    • View Profile

Offline mounir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • View Profile
Re: question on acclaimed contradiction
« Reply #2 on: October 25, 2017, 10:51:39 PM »
assalamu alaikum

i have a question on a contradiction that is claimed to be in the quran

the 2 verses in question are:

quran 38;71-2, [So mention] when your Lord said to the angels, "Indeed, I am going to create a human being from clay. So when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration."

and quran 15:28-29: And [mention, O Muhammad], when your Lord said to the angels, "I will create a human being out of clay from an altered black mud. And when I have proportioned him and breathed into him of My [created] soul, then fall down to him in prostration."

so it is obviously speaking about the very same event

however the claimed contradiction lies in what did allah say to the angels. because quran 38:71-72 allah didnt mention the altered black mud part
however quran 15 does include the part of the altered black mud.

so whcih of the two did allah swt say to the angels. because now it seems contradictory. did allah say to the angels i will create from clay, or did he say i will create from clay from altered black mud

because these 2 verses are direct quotes of what allah said. and it is speaking of the same event. so what did allah say to the angels and is it not a contradiction

the person who presented the acclaimed contradiction also included the following example:

If I was to tell you today that Neil Armstrong said these famous words as he stepped on to the moon's surface:
"That's one small step for man, but one giant leap for mankind"
Two days later, I say these words were:
"That's one small step for a human, but one giant leap for humanity"
It's recounting what was said. The content of the statements are not contradicting, but it is a contradiction of quotation. He said either the first, the second, or neither. He can't have said both those sentences as he stepped onto the moon.

Here's why the comparison between neil armstrong and this specific question is false.
In the example given you can clearly see the quran saying god said, and these are the correct translations for each verse "[So mention] when your Lord said to the angels, "Indeed, I am going to create a human being from clay." and "And [mention, O Muhammad], when your Lord said to the angels, "I will create a human being out of clay from an altered black mud." Now as you can see the first quotes says exactly, indeed i am going to create a human out of clay. And then next says, I will create a human being out of clay. The word for will and going in this example are the same in arabic. And so, here's what we can analyze. The quran does not explicitly say "the only thing allah said to them is" if it did, we would have an issue. But in this specific instance, the quran uses the same quote but expands on it in one example. With the neil armstrong example, you can't find part of the first sentence in the second. You must find all of the first sentence in the second for it to not be a quotation contradiction. But in this instance, as you can see, the entire first verse's sentence can be found in the second. Basically, since the quran didnt mess up on wording nor did it mention different sentences, it is not a contradiction. Instead it tells the second part of that quote. It keeps consistency unlike the armstrong example. Hope this helped. Remember you cannot assume explicits inside the quran, it has to explicitly say "allah only said to the angels....." Therefor, no contradiction.

Offline mounir

  • Jr. Member
  • **
    • View Profile
Re: question on acclaimed contradiction
« Reply #3 on: October 25, 2017, 11:03:17 PM »
If you dont know arabic, legit the same word for will create and going to create is used in both verses. Its just a matter of translation in the specific context

Heres the link to both verses - https://quran.com/15/28 https://quran.com/38/71

If you are wondering why the sheen is streched out in 15 28 its for further emphasis on the word to lead to the next compound arabic word. Its a matter of emphasis based grammer. Arabic works in such mysterious and magestic ways, I'd really recommend learning it. And as for why the clay in 15 28 appears longer then the one in 38 71, its the way you write a word in which right afterwards you provide its specifications/descriptions. No contradiction at all.