Author Topic: Proof  (Read 3373 times)

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Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #15 on: March 06, 2018, 12:09:30 pm »


I don't know what you are talking about, but he can't follow simple logic.
The Materialist God-rejector said:
"It's easy to impose a design upon things that exist by chance or developed through a natural process like evolution.
"
a-He claimed design is formed without a creator/designer !
b- He claimed creation is formed by "chance" !!
c- He claimed natural processes can "create".!
No one with even half-functioning brain would say that !
This should be slapped and told: There is no evidence you have been slapped !!

lbn Ata' As-Sakandari  said, "O  Allah! How can they cite  what  needs  You  as  an  evidence  for  You?!  Is there anything more evident than You to be cited as an evidence for You?!  When  did  You cease  watching  the  world  that we  need  an evidence  for  Your  existence?!  And how far did you go that now we have to pursue Your traces to find You?!  How can He be veiled while He disclosed everything?!  How can He be veiled while He is evident anywhere?!  How  can  He  be  veiled   while  He  is  the  ever Evident  and the only One Who has no peer?! How can He be veiled while He is nearer to us than anything else?! How can He be veiled while we owe our existence to Him?

Once, an atheist teacher said to his disciples, "only what you see really exists.  They answered, 'yes.' You notice the tablet, the pen, the notebook and the chair?  All of them are visible and touchable, aren't they?' 'Yes,' They replied.  Then he said, do you see God?  They replied, no. hence, God doesn't exist. The students were perplexed, because they believed in the existence of Allah by heart. Meanwhile, Allah disclosed the falsehood of these teachers at the hands of one of his disciples. A student after having permission   asked, do you understand what the teacher has said, they said, yes.  Ok, do you see the teacher now?  Yes, they replied.  Does the teacher have a mind? 'Yes,' they answered. 'Do you see his mind?' They said, 'No,' he said, following the teacher method i.e., "Only what we see does exist." Our teacher has no mind because it is invisible.  Then, all students laughed and the teacher was amazed and never mentioned that again.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=z4E_bT4ecgk

If this Human reject his creator, he has to find another body and universe to live in !


Akhi this will never EVER make a atheist a believer you know this right? This is not something which will convince people in any shape or form

Offline AMuslimDude213

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Re: Proof
« Reply #16 on: March 06, 2018, 02:31:58 pm »
Akhi,the Atheist are close minded.afcourse they wont accept but then why should we care about their disagreements?

they disagree with everything when facts are presented infront. Allah SWT gives the Hidayah not us.

Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #17 on: March 09, 2018, 09:22:34 pm »
I think its kind of sad how nobody is refuting the points?:( please somebody knowledgable enough would you refute it ? Like herr are so many intelligent people on this page please anyone who can refute it please do it!

Offline Zakir

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Re: Proof
« Reply #18 on: March 10, 2018, 10:20:15 am »
1) First, when considering this position, it's important to recognize the difference between complexity and design. Complexity itself does not require an intelligent creator. It's easy to impose a design upon things that exist by chance or developed through a natural process like evolution.

To an extent, this argument gains traction because of wide misunderstanding of science and especially evolution. Everything in the universe conforms to certain simple scientific rules that have been repeated over billions of years. While this can be awe-inspiring, it by no means suggests a creator.

Failure to understand the scientific principles guiding the creation and development of the universe does not mean that a deity must exist to explain the natural world.
2) This argument presupposes its premise. People believe in scripture and place value in the words because they already believe in the religious principles the text describes. There is no inherent value to the Bible, Quran or any other religious text; these documents are not self-authenticating in any way.

In fact, many factual inaccuracies and inconsistencies can be found within religious texts themselves. For example, the Bible contains two separate creation stories, each of which provides a very different explanation. Similarly, there is no historical, archaeological or scientific evidence to support many of the stories in the Bible and the Quran.

Ultimately, religious texts are infinitely fallible because they are man-made products of whimsy, poetry, mythology and some history woven together into a new whole. The texts in the Bible have been gathered from many oral sources over thousands of years and compiled arbitrarily into a single document; it's hardly surprising that the narrative would be so inconsistent. Other religious texts have similarly convoluted histories.

Aside from the problems with individual texts, there's also the obvious issue that the very presence of multiple scriptures negates the authenticity of any single religious document. It's impossible for every religious book to be true; it's highly presumptuous to assume that one's own preferred scripture is the single "true" scripture while all the others are false accounts. It's far more likely that every religious book is equally fictitious and unreliable.

3) This argument is often offered as a last line of defense in religious debates, and the person posing it might feel very clever coming up with it. However, the premise of the argument is both flawed and ridiculous. The failure to disprove something does not constitute proof of its existence.

The burden of proof is always on the person making a claim, especially in cases where the claims are unsupported or unfalsifiable. With no enduring evidence that a God exists, there is simply no reason to believe in a deity, even if it's not possible to irrefutably disprove his existence.

Many thought experiments have been created to show the absurdity of these claims, such as the Invisible Pink Unicorn, Carl Sagan's "The Dragon in My Garage," Russell's Teapot or the Flying Spaghetti Monster. All of which are absurd claims without evidence and yet impossible to disprove. Familiarizing yourself with these thought experiments can give you a clear picture of exactly why the burden of proof should always be on the person making a claim.
4) The existence of Unicorns can not be disproven, therefore there are Unicorns.
Does that make sense to you? Nobody can disprove the existence of any mythical entity, that does not mean they exist. We determine things based on evidence. No evidence, no reality, no exitence. This frustrates the hell out of theists, but they know it is true and they would not take it on faith if I told someone that I had a Leprachaun in my closet. They would want to see it for themselves.
5) Just as miracles are impossible to prove without resorting to unreliable anecdotes, the power of prayer is certainly not supported by science. Belief in prayer relies on confirmation bias. Essentially, people remember the times that prayer seemed to "work" but conveniently forget the many occasions that they prayed and saw no response or received the opposite result of what they'd wanted. These unwanted results are often ignored completely or rationalized away.

Prayer is a type of magical thinking. Its appeal is undeniable; it feels empowering and makes individuals feel as though they have a measure of control over the world around them. But there is simply no evidence that prayers are anything more than a placebo. And unlike many placebos, prayer can actually be harmful.

The "power of prayer" is one of the most insidious and even harmful beliefs proffered by religion. When faced with any sort of tragedy or misfortune, prayer is one of the least helpful responses imaginable.
Prayer is like gambling when your prayer is answered you tell everyone when you are ignored you keep it a secret.
These are the main athiest points thank you.
These points were refuted fully.

Offline Zakir

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Re: Proof
« Reply #19 on: March 10, 2018, 10:21:31 am »
*weren't

Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #20 on: March 10, 2018, 09:03:31 pm »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Offline AMuslimDude213

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Re: Proof
« Reply #21 on: March 11, 2018, 07:53:00 am »
Alright,okay Let me refute them.

1)Complexity and Design exists in the universe,just saying we have a System that is complex,does not negate a creator,Math equations can be complex,but someone made those math Equations out of his mind.
I tell every atheist,to grab some sand and throw it on the ground,see if it makes a human figure

2)The Quran is preserved tho,We have the oldest copies saying the Quran is preserved. as for inconsistencies,prove it,thats an assertion.

Now not only that,most of the Qurans historical narrative has been proven true,like the person who was the leader of Constructions under Pharoah.
And the last points are arguments from Ignorance,I mean just because there are too many religious books,doesnt mean all of them are false,infact it raises a chance of one of them being true because there are so many,as for them being false is unlikely because people must've witnessed something.


3)This argument is stupid,because God cannot be physical,if God is in the physical framework then that means its not a creator anymore,and is a creation,like Spaghetti monsters and Unicorns,all these have been proven to be created,and God has never been proven to be created,infact he's most likely eternal and existing

The spaghetti monster and Unicorn claim Infact this claim is so stupid,heres a refutation by a Christian
The “Flying Spaghetti Monster” is the creation of angry atheists.  They created this idea as a means to mock belief in God.  The premise is that belief in the God of the Bible is really about as believable as belief in the Flying Spaghetti Monster.  They have used this ironic and disrespectful idea as an argument against allowing for the teaching of Intelligent Design in schools. Their point is that if we are going to teach design, then we must give equal time to the Christian God and to the Flying Spaghetti Monster. 
This argument is really just rhetoric.  It ignores the fact that there is plenty of evidence for the God of the Bible.  Jesus fulfilled dozens of messianic prophecies.  Despite claims to the contrary, the Bible is the most reliable historical record from the ancient world.  The evidence for the resurrection of Jesus and for the miracles of Jesus are very strong.  To compare belief in the God of the Bible to belief in the Flying Spaghetti Monster is to demean the millions of highly educated people who have believed in the Bible because of the evidence that it is inspired. No one believes in the Flying Spaghetti Monster.  To equate these is sheer rhetoric, and you should recognize it for what it is. This argument is truly mean and disrespectful and it represents an attempt to use mere rhetoric to manipulatively move from legitimate discussion about the evidence for the reliability of the Bible, for which there is great evidence.
Should design be taught in science classes in the United States?  In my opinion, no, because design is not a scientific concept.  Design cannot be measured, it cannot be demonstrated by experiment, and it cannot be refuted by experiment.  I am totally convinced that the evidence from science points unequivocally toward the idea that the universe is designed, but design is not a scientific theory, so it probably belongs in a philosophy class or a religion class.  It can be mentioned in science classes, but it is not strictly science.
However, to invoke the Flying Spaghetti Monster as an argument against Christianity or as a reason to not teach design is mere rhetoric and really is not even an argument at all.  It is an embarrassment that atheists use this argument, but I suppose they will have to speak for themselves on why they use it. 
So, the reason you have trouble following this argument is that there is no argument to follow.  The Flying Spaghetti Monster is a mere rhetorical tool and it is not the basis for any actual rational argument.  It is evidence of bad behavior on the part of non-believers, not that you are having trouble understanding it!

5)These Subjective arguments are barely used by any Muslims,We use Probablistic reasoning to prove God,not Miracles and Prayers,and afcourse Prayer wont be proven by Science,prayer is something out of the reach of science,it depends on consciousness and the reaction of the Brain, Science cant even study the brain indepth,let alone the prayer..


Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #22 on: March 11, 2018, 04:52:44 pm »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Thanks akhi and i meant *it can be annoying

Offline Zakir

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Re: Proof
« Reply #23 on: March 11, 2018, 05:16:49 pm »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Thanks akhi and i meant *it can be annoying
Its amazing how much you guys help.


Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #25 on: March 11, 2018, 07:54:11 pm »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Thanks akhi and i meant *it can be annoying
Its amazing how much you guys help.


Is this sarcasm?

Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #26 on: March 11, 2018, 07:55:21 pm »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Thanks akhi and i meant *it can be annoying
Its amazing how much you guys help.

Btw im a female and i dong know the answers to your questions as i myself have them 🤷🏻‍♀️

Offline Albarra

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Re: Proof
« Reply #27 on: March 12, 2018, 12:23:35 am »


Btw im a female and i dong know the answers to your questions as i myself have them 🤷🏻‍♀️
[/quote]


Welcome to my world ;XD

I'm an alien, and I'm from Mars, lol!

Offline Zakir

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Re: Proof
« Reply #28 on: March 12, 2018, 10:38:29 am »
Akhi dont push the brothers tho, it can annoying ( it probably even is ) just wait, someone will answer in sha ALLAH

Thanks akhi and i meant *it can be annoying
Its amazing how much you guys help.


Is this sarcasm?
No

Offline Hayalilaydaa

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Re: Proof
« Reply #29 on: March 12, 2018, 03:42:25 pm »


Btw im a female and i dong know the answers to your questions as i myself have them 🤷🏻‍♀️


Welcome to my world ;XD

I'm an alien, and I'm from Mars, lol!
[/quote]

Hahaahah is said that because i only saw like one female on this page,and she wasnt active since 2 years i think? This page is full with males i feel lonely xD