Author Topic: who was slaughtered? ishaq or ismail?  (Read 1070 times)

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Offline Mahir Adnan

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who was slaughtered? ishaq or ismail?
« on: April 23, 2018, 01:07:00 pm »
can anyone prove from bible that hazat ismail (a.s.)  was in Arab and Ibrahim (a.s.) was about to slaughter him?

Offline Sama

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Re: who was slaughtered? ishaq or ismail?
« Reply #1 on: April 23, 2018, 02:50:30 pm »
This piece is entirely based on the work of Hamiduddin Farahi.

Introduction

We know from the Torah itself that it is not in the original form that was revealed by Allah.

    Concerning the prophets: My heart is broken within me; all my bones tremble. I am like a drunken man, like a strong man overcome by wine, because of the Lord and his holy words.The land is full of adulterers; because of the curse the land lies parched and the pastures in the wilderness are withered. The prophets follow an evil course and use their power unjustly.“Both prophet and priest are godless; even in my temple I find their wickedness,” declares the Lord.“Therefore their path will become slippery; they will be banished to darkness and there they will fall. I will bring disaster on them in the year they are punished,” declares the Lord.“Among the prophets of Samaria I saw this repulsive thing: They prophesied by Baal and led my people Israel astray.And among the prophets of Jerusalem I have seen something horrible: They commit adultery and live a lie. They strengthen the hands of evildoers, so that not one of them turns from their wickedness. They are all like Sodom to me; the people of Jerusalem are like Gomorrah.”Therefore this is what the Lord Almighty says concerning the prophets: “I will make them eat bitter food and drink poisoned water, because from the prophets of Jerusalem ungodliness has spread throughout the land.”This is what the Lord Almighty says: “Do not listen to what the prophets are prophesying to you; they fill you with false hopes. They speak visions from their own minds, not from the mouth of the Lord.They keep saying to those who despise me, ‘The Lord says: You will have peace.’ And to all who follow the stubbornness of their hearts they say, ‘No harm will come to you.’But which of them has stood in the council of the Lord to see or to hear his word? Who has listened and heard his word?See, the storm of the Lord will burst out in wrath, a whirlwind swirling down on the heads of the wicked.The anger of the Lord will not turn back until he fully accomplishes the purposes of his heart. In days to come you will understand it clearly.I did not send these prophets, yet they have run with their message; I did not speak to them, yet they have prophesied.But if they had stood in my council, they would have proclaimed my words to my people and would have turned them from their evil ways and from their evil deeds.“Am I only a God nearby,” declares the Lord, “and not a God far away?Who can hide in secret places so that I cannot see them?” declares the Lord. “Do not I fill heaven and earth?” declares the Lord.“I have heard what the prophets say who prophesy lies in my name. They say, ‘I had a dream! I had a dream!’How long will this continue in the hearts of these lying prophets, who prophesy the delusions of their own minds? They think the dreams they tell one another will make my people forget my name, just as their ancestors forgot my name through Baal worship. Let the prophet who has a dream recount the dream, but let the one who has my word speak it faithfully. For what has straw to do with grain?” declares the Lord. “Is not my word like fire,” declares the Lord, “and like a hammer that breaks a rock in pieces?“Therefore,” declares the Lord, “I am against the prophets who steal from one another words supposedly from me.Yes,” declares the Lord, “I am against the prophets who wag their own tongues and yet declare, ‘The Lord declares.’ Indeed, I am against those who prophesy false dreams,” declares the Lord. “They tell them and lead my people astray with their reckless lies, yet I did not send or appoint them. They do not benefit these people in the least,” declares the Lord. “When these people, or a prophet or a priest, ask you, ‘What is the message from the Lord?’ say to them, ‘What message? I will forsake you, declares the Lord.’ If a prophet or a priest or anyone else claims, ‘This is a message from the Lord,’ I will punish them and their household. This is what each of you keeps saying to your friends and other Israelites: ‘What is the Lord’s answer?’ or ‘What has the Lord spoken?’ But you must not mention ‘a message from the Lord’ again, because each one’s word becomes their own message. So you distort the words of the living God, the Lord Almighty, our God.[2]

And again we find elsewhere in the Torah: [3]

    “‘How can you say, “We are wise, for we have the law of the Lord,” when actually the lying pen of the scribes has handled it falsely? The wise will be put to shame; they will be dismayed and trapped. Since they have rejected the word of the Lord, what kind of wisdom do they have?

What is interesting is that Prophet Eisa (Jesus) –peace be upon him- also spoke similar words according to the New Testament:

    All who have come before me (means after prophets and before Jesus) are thieves and robbers, but the sheep have not listened to them. [4]

The Qur’an also confirms the Torah in this regard. We shall discuss these references later below.

How to interpret the Torah?

Since we know that the Torah has been altered, corrupted, mistranslated, translated from Greek to Hebrew to Greek with original Hebrew being lost etc. the question then arises as to how to interpret the book! Since we are investigating a matter (i.e. the identity of the sacrificial son), we must look into the matter like a judge. Evidence is tampered and hence everything cannot be taken as it is. Skeptical mind should be kept and investigation conducted. There is no such thing as a perfect crime and hence this crime of alteration should be viewed through the lens of a detective.

The Torah says that Allah had ordered Prophet Ibrahim –peace be upon him- to offer his son for sacrifice whereas Qur’an says he had seen a dream. This proves that the Qur’an does not copy and is there to correct the previous scriptures (more on this later below).

Some Muslim scholars who relied on Israeli traditions also fell into their trap. For example, Ibn Jarir in his “Tarikh” himself says that he relies on a nation’s own narrations regarding their history.

Evidences from the Torah

Importance of firstborn in the Torah

Under the old law firstborns were offered for sacrifice or offerings:

    But Abel brought fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The LORD looked with favor on Abel and his offering, [5]

    Another translation: And Abel also brought an offering—fat portions from some of the firstborn of his flock. The Lord looked with favor on Abel and his offering,

    “But you must not redeem the firstborn of a cow, a sheep or a goat; they are holy. Splash their blood against the altar and burn their fat as a food offering, an aroma pleasing to the Lord. Their meat is to be yours, just as the breast of the wave offering and the right thigh are yours. [6]

    The Lord said to Moses, “Consecrate to me every firstborn male. The first offspring of every womb among the Israelites belongs to me, whether human or animal.” [7]

Further importance of firstborn

    If a man has two wives, and he loves one but not the other, and both bear him sons but the firstborn is the son of the wife he does not love, when he wills his property to his sons, he must not give the rights of the firstborn to the son of the wife he loves in preference to his actual firstborn, the son of the wife he does not love. He must acknowledge the son of his unloved wife as the firstborn by giving him a double share of all he has. That son is the first sign of his father’s strength. The right of the firstborn belongs to him. [8]

The one offered to God does not have share of inheritance; God is for them:

    At that time the Lord set apart the tribe of Levi to carry the ark of the covenant of the Lord, to stand before the Lord to minister and to pronounce blessings in his name, as they still do today. That is why the Levites have no share or inheritance among their fellow Israelites; the Lord is their inheritance, as the Lord your God told them.) [9]

    The Levitical priests—indeed, the whole tribe of Levi—are to have no allotment or inheritance with Israel. They shall live on the food offerings presented to the Lord, for that is their inheritance. They shall have no inheritance among their fellow Israelites; the Lord is their inheritance, as he promised them. This is the share due the priests from the people who sacrifice a bull or a sheep: the shoulder, the internal organs and the meat from the head. [10]

Criteria for sacrifice

    “‘During the entire period of their Nazirite vow, no razor may be used on their head. They must be holy until the period of their dedication to the Lord is over; they must let their hair grow long. “‘Throughout the period of their dedication to the Lord, the Nazirite must not go near a dead body. Even if their own father or mother or brother or sister dies, they must not make themselves ceremonially unclean on account of them, because the symbol of their dedication to God is on their head. Throughout the period of their dedication, they are consecrated to the Lord. “‘If someone dies suddenly in the Nazirite’s presence, thus defiling the hair that symbolizes their dedication, they must shave their head on the seventh day—the day of their cleansing. [11]

Place and way of sacrifice is fixed by God

    But you are to seek the place the Lord your God will choose from among all your tribes to put his Name there for his dwelling. To that place you must go; there bring your burnt offerings and sacrifices, your tithes and special gifts, what you have vowed to give and your freewill offerings, and the firstborn of your herds and flocks. There, in the presence of the Lord your God, you and your families shall eat and shall rejoice in everything you have put your hand to, because the Lord your God has blessed you. [12]

    Moses placed the table in the tent of meeting on the north side of the tabernacle outside the curtain and set out the bread on it before the Lord, as the Lord commanded him. He placed the lampstand in the tent of meeting opposite the table on the south side of the tabernacle and set up the lamps before the Lord, as the Lord commanded him. Moses placed the gold altar in the tent of meeting in front of the curtain and burned fragrant incense on it, as the Lord commanded him. Then he put up the curtain at the entrance to the tabernacle. He set the altar of burnt offering near the entrance to the tabernacle, the tent of meeting, and offered on it burnt offerings and grain offerings, as the Lord commanded him. [13]

The story of sacrifice in the Torah that we have today

Genesis 22 mentions this event but the previous chapters are also important for the context which mention the place where Prophet Ibrahim –peace be upon him- and his sacrificial son lived and from where he took his son for sacrifice. It is mentioned that he wandered in Beersheba, made an agreement with a king and then returned to Palestine. At the end of the story is mentioned the place where he stayed and from where he went to the place of sacrifice. This should be clearly remembered before reading the event of sacrifice in Genesis 22. Let us look at the event from Genesis 22:

    Some time later God tested Ibrahim. He said to him, “Ibrahim!” “Here I am,” he replied. Then God said, “Take your son, your only son, whom you love—Ishaq—and go to the region of Moriah. Sacrifice him there as a burnt offering on a mountain I will show you.”Early the next morning Ibrahim got up and loaded his donkey. He took with him two of his servants and his son Ishaq. When he had cut enough wood for the burnt offering, he set out for the place God had told him about. On the third day Ibrahim looked up and saw the place in the distance. He said to his servants, “Stay here with the donkey while I and the boy go over there. We will worship and then we will come back to you.” Ibrahim took the wood for the burnt offering and placed it on his son Ishaq, and he himself carried the fire and the knife. As the two of them went on together, Ishaq spoke up and said to his father Ibrahim, “Father?” “Yes, my son?” Ibrahim replied. “The fire and wood are here,” Ishaq said, “but where is the lamb for the burnt offering?”Ibrahim answered, “God himself will provide the lamb for the burnt offering, my son.” And the two of them went on together. When they reached the place God had told him about, Ibrahim built an altar there and arranged the wood on it. He bound his son Ishaq and laid him on the altar, on top of the wood. Then he reached out his hand and took the knife to slay his son. But the angel of the Lord called out to him from heaven, “Ibrahim! Ibrahim!” “Here I am,” he replied.“Do not lay a hand on the boy,” he said. “Do not do anything to him. Now I know that you fear God, because you have not withheld from me your son, your only son.”Ibrahim looked up and there in a thicket he saw a ram caught by its horns. He went over and took the ram and sacrificed it as a burnt offering instead of his son.So Ibrahim called that place The Lord Will Provide. And to this day it is said, “On the mountain of the Lord it will be provided.” The angel of the Lord called to Ibrahim from heaven a second time 16 and said, “I swear by myself, declares the Lord, that because you have done this and have not withheld your son, your only son,I will surely bless you and make your descendants as numerous as the stars in the sky and as the sand on the seashore. Your descendants will take possession of the cities of their enemies, and through your offspring all nations on earth will be blessed, because you have obeyed me.”Then Ibrahim returned to his servants, and they set off together for Beersheba. And Ibrahim stayed in Beersheba.

Summary


–       Beersheba was the resting place before and after the sacrifice

–       Moriah is at a distance of three days from Beersheba

–       Moriah is the place where sacrifice took place

–       This place is visible from a distance

–       He sacrificed his only son

–       This son was much beloved to him

–       There was a bush near the sacrificial place

–       Due to sacrificing the only son, Allah blessed him

–       And through his son, Allah promised to make the land blessed for all nations

–       His generation would be the owners of cities of their enemies

As the Torah itself confirms that it has been corrupted, it would not be unwise to investigate this story with a skeptical mind. The series of events strongly indicate that the name of Prophet Isma’il –peace be upon him- has been switched with the name of Prophet Ishaaq –peace be upon him. We shall prove that below with a number of evidences.

The resting place of Prophets Ibrahim and Isma’il – peace be upon them

When Prophet Ibrahim –peace be upon him – left for sacrifice, he did not have Ishaq –peace be upon him – with him but only Isma’il –peace be upon him – who used to live with him. Those who switched the names perhaps did not know this fact or overlooked it.

This is clear from above that after the sacrifice, Ibrahim –peace be upon him – returned to Beersheba to his home where he lived. Beersheba is the place where Isma’il –peace be upon him – lived with his mother. The place where the Torah mentions the story of separation of Isma’il –peace be upon him – and his mother with Ishaq –peace be upon him – and his mother clearly mentions this fact about Beersheba.

    Early the next morning Ibrahim took some food and a skin of water and gave them to Hagar. He set them on her shoulders and then sent her off with the boy. She went on her way and wandered in the Desert of Beersheba. [14]

With this, we can establish the following:

–       Beersheba was the home of Isma’il -peace be upon him- and his mother

–       This place was away from the home of Ishaq -peace be upon him- and his mother

–       This is also the home of Ibrahim –peace be upon him- and it is from here that he went for sacrifice and came back to this place after the sacrifice

–       The home of Sarah -peace be upon her- was far from the home of Ibrahim -peace be upon him. Another evidence for that is that when she fell ill, he was not there with her and when he heard the news of her death, he had to travel there to her. [15]

Assuming that Ishaq -peace be upon him- had been born then (which will be proven false below), he lived far in Canaan and it is established that Ibrahim -peace be upon him- took his son Isma’il -peace be upon him- from Beersheba for sacrifice and came back to Beersheba.

The son sacrificed had been left at the place of sacrifice which is proven from his statement when Ishaq -peace be upon him- was born.

    And Ibrahim said to God, “If only Isma’il might live under your blessing!” i.e. he might live in servitude to your house. [16]

The Qur’an confirms this:

    Our Lord, I have settled some of my descendants in an uncultivated valley near Your sacred House, our Lord, that they may establish prayer. [17]

The son in uncultivated land was none other than Isma’il -peace be upon him-. Ibrahim -peace be upon him- had settled his two families in Beersheba and Canaan and had himself chosen a place to live between the two as mentioned by the Torah: [18]

    And his sons Ishaq and Isma’il buried him in the cave of Machpelah, in the field of Ephron the son of Zohar the Hittite, which is before Mamre;

The only son

Isma’il -peace be upon him- was the only son as Genesis 16:16 says that Ibrahim -peace be upon him- was 86 when first son was born and 100 years old when second son was born. [19] No one can say that since Isma’il -peace be upon him- had gone far away so Ishaq -peace be upon him- became the only son because the reality is that he lived with his father and mother in Beersheba whereas the other son was far away.

It appears that “only son” had been replaced by “firstborn” son for which the lying scribes must have some scheme. Perhaps by changing the word “firstborn” with “only son”, they attempted to make them the only sons of their mothers and attempted to explain away this through twisting and distorting the text.

Most loved thing is offered for sacrifice

Isma’il -peace be upon him- was beloved to his father. It is mentioned above that the son ordered for sacrifice was most loved. [20] There are numerous evidences in the Torah proving that Prophet Isma’il -peace be upon him- was much beloved to his father.

    And Abram said, Lord God, what wilt thou give me, seeing I go childless, and the steward of my house is this Eliezer of Damascus? And Abram said, Behold, to me thou hast given no seed: and, lo, one born in my house is mine heir. And, behold, the word of the Lord came unto him, saying, This shall not be thine heir; but he that shall come forth out of thine own bowels shall be thine heir. [21]

When his first son was born, he named him Isma’il which means “God heard the prayer”. [22] Imagine the love he would have had for him; an old man who is childless and prays to Allah for offspring gets blessed by Allah with a son who is named “prayer accepted” who is never kept away from his sight till he is 14 years old. He loves him dearly while having no expectation for another child. The love of the father for his son was immense as the Torah also states:

    And Ibrahim said unto God, O that Isma’il might live before thee! [23]

This, he says, when his second son is born. When his wife asks him to expel his wife and son (as the Bible claims), he felt very grieved and upset:

    And the thing was very grievous in Ibrahim’s sight because of his son. [24]

The place of sacrifice

The place of sacrifice is Marwah (near Safa) near the Ka’abah. We have already read this verse:

    On the third day Ibrahim looked up and saw the place in the distance. [25]

This is neither Solomon’s temple as claimed by the Jews, nor the place of crucifixion as claimed by the Christians. The instances where this place ‘Moriah’ has appeared in the Torah has been translated as Moriah, Moreh (a different spelling for the same place), high grounds, noble vale, high hill. Same translations have used the word Moreh in one place and an alternate word in another place but never used as Solomon’s temple in any place. The description of this place does not fit the temple in any way.

John Colenso has mentioned that Torah mentions a place visible from far away towards which Ibrahim -peace be upon him- lifted his sight whereas no such place can be found that can be linked to this place. The mount Solomon or mount Moriah does not have any evidence and these mounts are only visible when a person comes from the east crossing the valley of hinnom and reaches there. Then he would be able to see from above the temple. John Colenso quotes Canon Stanley:

    The Jewish tradition, as represented by Josephus, transfers the scene to the hill, on which the Temple was afterwards erected at Jerusalem; and this belief has been perpetuated in Christian times, as attached to a spot in the garden of the Abyssinian Convent, not indeed, on Mount Moriah, but immediately to the east of the Church of the Holy Sepulchre, with the intention of connecting the sacrifice of Isaac with the Crucifixion. [26]

Stanley rejects the Jewish and the Christian claim. He also rejects Muslim claim [27] saying that it is not Mount Arafat as the Muslims claim according to him. Muslims never make this claim. His research on the Muslim claim is basically not a research but rather a rash conclusion without research into the matter at all. According to him Mount Gerizim is the actual place of sacrifice which the Samaritans also believe However, their book of Samaritans is also different from other Jews and they are considered close by the Christians to themselves.

The purpose here is to show that the place is not a confirmed and agreed upon area by the Jews and Christians; neither with each other nor with among themselves. There is immense difference of opinion on the actual place of sacrifice so much so that one group all together removed the actual place Moriah from the translation and translated it differently. One group kept the name but changed the place while some kept the name but changed the pronunciation such as Moriah, Moreh etc. This is the same trick identified by Qur’an:

    يأَهْلَ الْكِتَـبِ لِمَ تَلْبِسُونَ الْحَقَّ بِالْبَـطِلِ وَتَكْتُمُونَ الْحَقَّ وَأَنتُمْ تَعْلَمُونَ

    O People of the Scripture, why do you mix [i.e. confuse] the truth with falsehood and conceal the truth while you know [it]? [28]

The real name of the place is Marwah

Marwah means sticky and shiny rock. The translators who have translated the Biblical word as high grounds, noble vale, high hill prove through their translation that this word was not pronounced or read as Moriah, Moreh etc. as the scribes had altered it. The translators state that the root of the word Moriah/Moreh is ירה pronounced as yaraa or yaraah. Yaraa means fear or surprise and hence Moreh means fear or reason for fear. Yaraah means archery and saturation or to quench. Both the roots give a different meaning which no way comes close to grounds, noble vale, high hill etc. It is clear that translators originally and initially got the word Marwah but because this word wasn’t in their dictionary, they considered it as Maraah and it is also a rule in Hebrew that “wa” is mostly replaced by “aa”. That is why, according to rules of their language, they considered it to be linked with “Raah” which means view, offer etc. which is why they gave the meaning as such. Some translators have given meanings to this word while some have retained the original word in its various forms.

Real word Marwah: ה י ר מ [Read from right to left]

Changed word Murya / Muriyyah: ה י ר מ

Changed word Moriah: ה י ר ו מ

Changed word Moreh: ה ר ו מ

Ponder over the changes in the letters. The main difference is the letter O coming after M also pronounced as “wa”. In the first case (Muryah), “wa” changes completely. The changing of this wa in Hebrew can be explained by practical examples.

Example:

Jaul: ל ו ג

Jail: ל ו ג

Where there is “Wa” in Arabic has “Ya” in Hebrew (Jail has ‘ya’ sound between ‘Ja’ and ‘La’), for example, dlu (bucket) in Arabic is dli (Hebrew) in Hebrew; the letter “wa” changes to “ya”. Walad is yalad, waqar is yaqar etc.

Those who do not know either Arabic or Hebrew might find it hard to grasp how ‘i’ at the end of dli can be considered as “ya” and ‘u’ at the end of dlu can be considered “wa”. The answer is that this letter “wa” is pronounced differently when added with different words and becomes o, w, u. The same is with “ya”, it becomes i, e, y, ya, ay.

Therefore, if one was to write Marwah in Hebrew, it would replace wa with ya (or one of its various forms) and hence turn into Maryah, Moriah, Moreh etc.

In real Hebrew, like Arabic, there were no vowels (bamma, kathra, fathha, tanween etc.). This opened the doors for further tampering. This word was also originally written without vowels.

Original word: ה ר ר מ (Marwah). This same word can be pronounced as Muriyyah, Moriah and Moreh without adding vowels. Muslims may understand this example by “من” which can be pronounced as Mann (Who), Minn (From), Munn (No such word) and a number of other ways (remember that there are no vowels and therefore adding these oneself can be pronounced in a number of ways). The sentence would define what the word means. Reading alone the word “من” can either be Who or From. The same is the case with Hebrew. The letters “M” ”R” ”H” are together in Hebrew and can be pronounced in a number of ways. As proven that Moreh, Moriah etc. have no meaning at all, Marwah, a correct pronunciation, is the only option applicable.

    The host of the Midianites were on the north side of them, by the hill of Moreh, in the valley. [29]

The mount Marwah was in the land of Midian. On a side note, a line in the link confirms the above explanation of Hebrew vowels in one sentence:

    The modern Hebrew pronunciation, “Midyan”, is the result of a normal vowel shift changing an “a” sound to an “i” sound (compare Miryam in Hebrew versus Mariam in Greek or Maryam in Arabic).

Famous Qur’an translator Sale states that Madyan was from the cities of Hijaz (Arabia). It was situated on the south west of Sinai near the Red Sea. There is no doubt that this is the same place Batlimos mentioned by the name of Moriana.

Moreover, the Bible itself mentions that this place, Midian, was the place of Isma’ilites:

    Then the men of Israel said unto Gideon, Rule thou over us, both thou, and thy son, and thy son’s son also: for thou hast delivered us from the hand of Midian. And Gideon said unto them, I will not rule over you, neither shall my son rule over you: the Lord shall rule over you. And Gideon said unto them, I would desire a request of you, that ye would give me every man the earrings of his prey. (For they had golden earrings, because they were Isma’ilites.) [30]

    And they sat down to eat bread: and they lifted up their eyes and looked, and, behold, a company of Isma’ilites came from Gilead with their camels bearing spicery and balm and myrrh, going to carry it down to Egypt.And Judah said unto his brethren, What profit is it if we slay our brother, and conceal his blood?Come, and let us sell him to the Isma’ilites, and let not our hand be upon him; for he is our brother and our flesh. And his brethren were content.Then there passed by Midianites merchantmen; and they drew and lifted up Joseph out of the pit, and sold Joseph to the Isma’ilites for twenty pieces of silver: and they brought Joseph into Egypt. [31]

From this we know that Marwah is in Madian and Madian were Isma’ilites which was in Arabia. A saying of Prophet Muhammad –on him be the peace and blessings of Allah- makes matters very clear.

    حَدَّثَنِي يَحْيَى، عَنْ مَالِكٍ، أَنَّهُ بَلَغَهُ أَنَّ رَسُولَ اللَّهِ صلى الله عليه وسلم قَالَ بِمِنًى ‏”‏ هَذَا الْمَنْحَرُ وَكُلُّ مِنًى مَنْحَرٌ ‏”‏ ‏.‏ وَقَالَ فِي الْعُمْرَةِ ‏”‏ هَذَا الْمَنْحَرُ – يَعْنِي الْمَرْوَةَ – وَكُلُّ فِجَاجِ مَكَّةَ وَطُرُقِهَا مَنْحَرٌ

    Yahya related to me from Malik that he had heard that the Messenger of Allah, may Allah bless him and grant him peace, said once at Mina, “This place (where I have just sacrificed), and the whole of Mina, is a place of sacrifice,” and he said once during Umrah, “This (is the real) place of sacrifice” meaning Marwah, “and all the pathways of Makkah and its roads are (also) a place of sacrifice.” [32]

Isma’il -peace be upon him- was the deserving one to be offered for sacrifice

He was firstborn son and from Adam to Musa (Moses) -peace be upon them-, the rule had been to offer only firstborn. Firstborn had immense importance and it would be an attack on such a great prophet to say that he did not follow the law, did not live up to the law, the standard and expectation! Will such a great prophet not offer his best for sacrifice?

Good news of Ishaq –peace be upon him

The news of blessing of descendants of Ishaq -peace be upon him- to Ibrahim -peace be upon him- was only given when he was born whereas that of Isma’il -peace be upon him- was given after Ishaq -peace be upon him- or when he was born.

    And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Ishaq: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him. And as for Isma’il, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation. [33]

Is this possible that on one place God gives good news of blessing the generation of Ishaq –peace be upon him- and then give the order of sacrificing him? Further assuming for the sake of argument that it really was Ishaq -peace be upon him-, still he was not married when offered for sacrifice. [34]

    And it came to pass after the death of Ibrahim, that God blessed his son Ishaq; and Ishaq dwelt by the well Lahairoi. [35]

Ishaq -peace be upon him- became a father after the passing away of his father.

    And these are the days of the years of Ibrahim’s life which he lived, an hundred threescore and fifteen years. [36]

He lived 175 years.

    And after that came his brother out, and his hand took hold on Esau’s heel; and his name was called Jacob: and Ishaq was threescore years old when she bare them. [37]

Ishaq –peace be upon him- was 60 years old when he became a father. 175 years of his father minus 100 years (age when second son as born) = 75 years. So if Ishaq –peace be upon him- became father after the passing away of his father, then how was a son born to him 15 years before the passing away of his father? This only proves the claim of the Torah and the Qur’an regarding the corruption of the Torah. However, let’s ignore this contradiction for a while and understand the point that Ishaq –peace be upon him- was old when he became a father!

A normal criterion for sacrifice is reaching age of maturity. Elder son was mature and perhaps married as well as Ibn Kathir states “as he grew up and when he reached the age of puberty they made him marry a woman from amongst them” Puberty would mean he married at 12 or 13. As per tafsir, incident of sacrifice took place after the marriage of the sacrificial son.

If one claims that Isma’il -peace be upon him- was also blessed at his birth, then that news was given to his mother and not the father who was put to test. If his mother was given the task of sacrifice, then it would have been contradictory that on hand the son has been blessed and on another, he is to be offered for sacrifice; she would have surely known that her son would survive as the promise to bless his generation has already been made.

The event took place before the birth of Ishaq -peace be upon him

Genesis 17 is full of blessings for Ibrahim -peace be upon him- because he had passed the test. Covenants were made and offspring were blessed because of it. Father (99) and son (13) both got circumcised and due to his sacrifice, his first wife was also given good news of having a son.

All these great events are of the same time and chain of the same event i.e. due to passing the test and not due to circumcision.

    And I will bless her, and give thee a son also of her: yea, I will bless her, and she shall be a mother of nations; kings of people shall be of her. Then Ibrahim fell upon his face, and laughed, and said in his heart, Shall a child be born unto him that is an hundred years old? and shall Sarah, that is ninety years old, bear? And Ibrahim said unto God, O that Isma’il might live before thee! And God said, Sarah thy wife shall bear thee a son indeed; and thou shalt call his name Ishaq: and I will establish my covenant with him for an everlasting covenant, and with his seed after him. And as for Isma’il, I have heard thee: Behold, I have blessed him, and will make him fruitful, and will multiply him exceedingly; twelve princes shall he beget, and I will make him a great nation. [38]

This took place when Ibrahim –peace be upon him- found out that his son offered for sacrifice and left there had been saved and blessed to be a leader of great nation. Readers here must be appreciating the claim that the Torah has been corrupted.

No inheritance for the sacrificial one

    And Ibrahim gave all that he had unto Ishaq. But unto the sons of the concubines, which Ibrahim had, Ibrahim gave gifts, and sent them away from Ishaq his son, while he yet lived, eastward, unto the east country. [39]

This proves that his elder son did not inherit anything who was very beloved to him. If anyone claims that the father could be angry later on, then there is no basis for this in the Torah. Besides, the Torah proves that both sons were beloved as they were not sent far away from where he lived. In fact both came to bury him. [40]

The reason he did not inherit anything is because those offered for sacrifice do not inherit anything as mentioned above.

Isma’il -peace be upon him- is mentioned as blessed

    And Abraham said to God, “If only Ishmael might live under your blessing!” (live before you). [41]

Live before you means to continue to serve You. This proves that he had already been at the service of God, and this was at the Ka’abah, before the sacrifice and he prayed that he might continue to serve Him. [42]

Nothing of such sort can be found in Jewish Shariah

If the event of sacrifice would have happened with Ishaq -peace be upon him- as the Jews say, then there would have been something like the Hajj in their Shariah. They do not even claim for any worship, out of several of their worships, that this is the basis as they do for other worships such as sacrifice (Exodus 13:11-12) and other forms of worship like fasting Ashura etc. Deuteronomy 16:1-17 mentions many rituals but none of them is claimed to be of this sacrifice. On the contrary, the rituals of Hajj and its many rituals such as repeating Labbaik (I am present at Your Service) etc. prove the sacrifice of Ibrahim –peace be upon him. Other voluntary sacrifices in Jewish Shariah [43] are merely ordinary offerings and not as grand as the Islamic one. Jews and Christians do not have the remembrance of the sacrifice by Ibrahim -peace be upon him- as they tampered with it, removed many things about such things and Makkah and gave all love and respect to Jerusalem.

The Torah is filled with sacrifices and portrays it as a form of worship. There is pretty much close to nil mention of prayer. Even most Jews do not believe in prayer as obligatory form of worship and only as voluntary. So sacrifice is their only worship which can only be done at Solomon’s temple [44] but they have remained away from the temple in many ages. Therefore the eras they remained in exile, in captivity, under occupation or forced out, they lived as faithless as they do not properly believe in prayer while sacrifice can only be done in one place.

Christians have attempted to answer this problem. They say that they do not turn to material temple but in the heaven (either spiritual or metaphorical or literally in heaven). This is wrong because the Bible makes it clear that they will obtain pleasure of God from this very temple and He will listen to their prayers and wishes. [45]

https://callingchristians.com/2014/01/01/the-sacrificial-son-ismail-or-isaac/

Further readings:
https://questionsonislam.com/question/some-people-say-hz-ibrahims-son-he-wanted-sacrifice-was-hz-ishaq-how-true-it

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Re: who was slaughtered? ishaq or ismail?
« Reply #2 on: April 24, 2018, 12:53:00 am »
can anyone prove from bible that hazat ismail (a.s.)  was in Arab and Ibrahim (a.s.) was about to slaughter him?

Both the Bible and the Glorious Quran agree that:

1-  Ishmael's covenant was put on hold (pause) until the Jewish covenant comes to pass, and the latter generations come.

2-  Ishmael's name means the GOD finally heard the Prayer.  Ishmael's name is a great proof that he was the sacrificed son.  He was born after long decades of frustration and long waits.  He was born after a long time of decades of desperationIsaac would not have been that big of a deal relatively speaking, because Ishmael was already born, and the long horrid desperation was long gone.  And Ishmael at the time was his only son, and for a long time too.  Ishmael was 13 years older than Isaac.  Peace be upon them all.

The challenge wasn't just for Abraham to give up his son for GOD Almighty.  Any mere person can do this, even to pagan deities:

[006:137]  Even so, in the eyes of most of the pagans, their "partners" made alluring the slaughter of their children, in order to lead them to their own destruction, and cause confusion in their religion. If God had willed, they would not have done so: But leave alone them and their inventions.

While it was a test for Abraham to give up his son for GOD Almighty, but I believe it was also more of testing Abraham to give up what he longed for, and was desperate for, for many decades.  And it was also to honor Ishmael, the Prophet of Allah Almighty.  Peace be upon Abraham and his sons.



It matters not:

Let me make it absolutely clear that Islam does not stand and fall on:

(a)-  Whether Ishmael was the sacrificed-to-be son or not.
(b)-  Or whether Abraham and his children were Arabs or not.

None of this matters in Islam.  We are only presenting what the Glorious Quran confirms here.  If Isaac was the sacrificed son, then it wouldn't matter.  We still say Peace be upon all of Allah Almighty's Prophets and Messengers.  And Isaac was certainly one of them, and we love Isaac and revere him as much as Ishmael and all of Allah Almighty's Prophets.  Peace be upon them all.

And again, ethnicity has nearly no value in Islam:

[049:013] O mankind! We created you from a single (pair) of a male and a female, and made you into nations and tribes, that ye may know each other (not that ye may despise each other). Verily the most honoured of you in the sight of God is (he who is) the most righteous of you. And God has full knowledge and is well acquainted (with all things).

This Noble Verse is not just to Muslims, but to all humans.  For more details, please visit:

www.answering-christianity.com/islam.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/convert_christians.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/ac22.htm#links
www.answering-christianity.com/ac23.htm#links


3-  The Jews' accounts and the Bible's credibility are a joke!  The Jews fabricated many lies.  Ironically, their accounts even admit this.

I have thoroughly proven this at:

www.answering-christianity.com/isaac_and_ishmael.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/Rebekah_story_proves_bible_full_of_hoaxes.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/jews_from_essence_liars_bible_declares.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/deuteronomy4_2.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/predict.htm


As to Ishmael being an Arab, again, it matters not.  But if you care to know, Abraham, Ishmael and Isaac's father, was from Iraq.  Most Iraqis are Arabs.  Assyrians and others are a minority.  And even Assyrians and Kurds and others speak Arabic, and their bloods are mixed with Arabs.  Arabic had always been the dominant language in the Middle East and North and Central Africa for 20,000 years, if not even more.  And it's the language of the Holy Quran, Allah Almighty's Perfect and Miraculous Book with 1000s of Numerical and Scientific Miracles [1], and also Prophecies [2].  See literally the 1000s of STUNNING Miracles are  listed here.  Also visit:

www.answering-christianity.com/muslims_during_early_christians_times.htm

Arabic was proven to date back 8,000 to 20,000 years ago.  Also more proofs that Jesus also preached in Arabic.  Arabic had always been a first language in the Middle East, and North and Central Africa.  But again, it matters not to Islam what ethnicity Abraham was.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah