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Title: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 11, 2017, 12:10:05 AM
Assalam alikum I was just wondering does this verse 36:41 prove that every one on earth is from the people of the ark because if yes doesn't that cause problems because we know thamud exsist about 3000 bc because we have there dwellings and we know the quran says that noah peace be upon him was close to ad and thamud and we know humans have been here at least 40 thousand bc so I was needing help on this

36:41 is And a Sign for them (is) that We carried their offspring in the ship laden.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 11, 2017, 12:30:57 AM
Also qustion 2. in verse 54:13 it says (we created the ark with planks and nails) but nails didn't exsist back that far back metal was not discovered till 9000 bc and noah would had to come way before if we all come from the people on the ark
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 11, 2017, 05:41:51 AM
Also they use 69:11 (we carried you in the boat)
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 11, 2017, 06:07:27 AM
Sorry the verse is (Indeed, when the water overflowed, We carried your ancestors in the sailing ship) also they use this to say the flood was global not local so how do we explain to them there wrong
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: submit on April 11, 2017, 07:54:10 AM
If the timeline is close to the biblical version, then nails should have existed then. If the timeline is multi millenniums ago before the biblcial version.
Then the building of rigid ark was thru the guidance and aid of angels following commands given by Creator.

Quote
And construct the ship under Our observation and Our inspiration and do not address Me concerning those who have wronged; indeed, they are [to be] drowned."  (11:37)

Any version of global flood or local flood will still not be an issue as the the offspring inside the ark later become the forefathers of the semitic nations.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 11, 2017, 06:05:12 PM
Ok so when you say the semitic nations you mean those verses 69:11 and 36:41 are talking about the Arabs and children of israily not everyone on earth being the offspring if the flood was local and only for the nation of noah is that correct what you that these verses are just saying the Arabs and children of israily are the offspring of the ark not every on earth
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: submit on April 12, 2017, 05:52:12 AM
yes it should be referring to the descendants within the region of middle east.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 12, 2017, 07:28:54 PM
Thanks jazzakkallah but the 69:11-12 sounds like it's talking to all of us because it says the word (you) in 69:11 and in 69:12 (it says it's a reminder a sign for you) so how would we reply back to someone who says this but thanks jazzakkallah 
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: submit on April 13, 2017, 05:53:44 AM
69:8 reminder to the semitic people whom were the audience of the revelations, reminder about perished nations in middle east.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 13, 2017, 11:49:02 AM
Thanks but aren't the verses meant to be for everyone not just them is there any more detail you could give me how to respond sorry jazzakkallah and also don't you mean 69:11-12 not 69:8 sorry to keep bothering you but thanks for the help you have given me thanks but like I said sorry to keep bothering you
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 13, 2017, 01:34:46 PM
Like what happens if there were any non semitic races there wasn't there companion off the prophet peace bs upon him who was a (roman) wouldn't off him off been there at the time so wouldn't off the verses off talked to him if yes that would off meant he wasn't a semitic person race so wouldn't that mean these verses mean we all come from noahs ark this is what they say and I don't know how to reply jazzakkallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 13, 2017, 01:40:21 PM
I mean Like what happens if there were any non semitic races there when the revelation was sent down and addressed too who were there mixed with or up with the semitic races people wouldn't off the verses been addressed to if yes that would mean the paragraph above


Sorry I meant to put this at the beginning of the paragraph above sorry but thanks jazzakkallah for the help
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 14, 2017, 12:36:09 AM
Like egyptians wouldn't off there been some of them there there not semitic so how do we explain this sorry jazzakkallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 14, 2017, 02:19:11 AM
And they use We rescued him (Nuh) and the occupants of the Ark and made that into a Sign for all the worlds. (29:15) they say the story is know every where because we have too come from the ark so how do we explain this as well including the stuff as well I wrote above the 4 bits posts above after what you just wrote jazzakkallah sorry to keep bothering just try to understand to reply back to them jazzakkallah but thanks jazzakkallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 16, 2017, 10:52:49 AM
Any thoughts sorry
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 18, 2017, 02:52:30 AM
It's still referring to Semitic races,it isn't referring to the ancestors of the Roman or Non Semitic sahabis,it is Quran,revealed by Allah,the Noah's ark is only referring to the semites,If a Sahabi was non Semetic why does that matter? The new Message by God,Islam is for all mankind,but the message of Noah was not to all of Mankind,but his own people,so there's your answer.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 18, 2017, 03:02:35 AM
When the Quran says "You" it refers to The people in the Ark,the Quran speaks from different perspectives since Allah had made it that way Nuh a.s and his people got this message from the Quran so it is to them,not us,
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 18, 2017, 06:34:30 AM
Thanks jazzakkallah my point for the non semitic person was

Imagine that your speaking to a group of people of 20 people but 1 of them was a non semitic person but you say to them that you are from the ancestors of the ark that non semitic person would think he came from the ark as well but you are meaning the semitic races but that non semitic person would think he came from the ark that's my point what I meant because the verses 36:41 and 69:11-12 sounds like all to them and if there was a companion who was non semitic he would think he came from them what would make it sound like all of us like 69:12 says a reminder to all so again it makes it sound like all like 36:40 says a sign for all so again sounds for all of us because they use saying 36:39 is talking to all of us about the solar system

But I see what you mean thanks but this is what I meant sorry for reapting myself
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 18, 2017, 07:30:31 AM
Because the you in 69:11 sounds more like you meaning your ancestors you people not the you too noah or his people on the ark peace be upon him jazzakkallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 19, 2017, 03:11:32 AM
36:41 is a mistranslation,it says them not You

http://www.qtafsir.com/index.php?option=com_content&task=view&id=1486&Itemid=92
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 19, 2017, 03:36:55 AM
And on Your ancestors in 69:11,Again the You is refering to Noah's people,In Surah Haqqah. Even if it is ancestors so what? Everyone's ancestry came from the middle eastern region,even Whites!,since the time Noah existed,almost all of civilization was in Middle East.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 19, 2017, 08:06:30 AM
Ok thanks jazzakkallah last qustion so is it only the semitic races or most of middle east and Egypt or everyone who comes from the ark
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 19, 2017, 08:07:59 AM
And so what does 69:12 mean to you thanks jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 19, 2017, 08:47:13 AM
It is referring to Semitic races,Arabia,Assyria,etc,etc these were Semitic races.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 19, 2017, 08:49:12 AM
And on 69:12 tafsir Ibn Kathir explains it well

(and that it might be retained by the retaining ears.) (69:12) means, "An ear that hears it and retains it, meaning the person who has sound hearing, and correct intellect.'' And this is general concerning everyone who understands and retains.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: submit on April 19, 2017, 10:25:23 AM
say if there were chinese ethnicity tribes in Arabia whom became People of the Book by believing in the Day of Resurrection , they should be able to relate to themselves the message when they listen to verses that spoke about past events where ancestors of the semitic tribes being punished for rejecting the Messengers.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 19, 2017, 11:23:45 AM
Ok thanks jazzakallah also non related does these verses prove there was a large gap between thamud and Abraham peace be upon him the verses are 25:38 23:44 and 14:9
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 19, 2017, 03:32:18 PM
Also going back to what you said so when you say if there were Chinese example they would know they were not descents of the ark but would just learn what those verses meant to the semitic people and take example from them learn from the verses if morals and examples is that what you meant jazzakallah


Also the trouble with in Katherine he be believes from those verses that we all come from the ark but off course he is wrong on that isn't he jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: submit on April 26, 2017, 07:05:58 AM
the verses do not describe the specific period gap of the tribes. Hence  interpreters used  Israelites tradition as reference.

~~~~
as one reads from 69:1 to 69:11, it spoke about how  the semitic tribes were punished and their semitic ancestors were brought thru the ship.

however, if the ones who are raised with Israelites tradition read those verses, as they reach verse 69:11 it shall be interpreted as global flood and all mankind descend from the ship.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 26, 2017, 08:46:14 AM
Thanks so conclusion these verses are talking about the semitic races not all mankind jazzakallah is that correct
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 26, 2017, 11:33:02 AM
That only the Arabs and children of Israel came from the ark not all mankind is that right jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 27, 2017, 06:19:50 PM
Is that right also was noah's nation the first ever nation to commit shirk or were there others jazzakallah at the same time
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 28, 2017, 06:54:07 PM
Any thoughts sorry
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 29, 2017, 06:07:52 PM
Also the you in 69:11 speaks in 2nd person not 3rd so the you is too them or all of us
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 30, 2017, 08:56:36 AM
In 69:11 it is to them,Allah is speaking from a different perspective here,in this verse he I see speaking to Nuh and his people and saying "You" as in Nuh,etc,etc and only Egypt,no there is no mention of Egypt it was most probably in Iraq-Syria where the flood happened.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 30, 2017, 09:01:39 AM
True so when it speaks in second person it is to noah and the believers but what does 69:12 mean is that to noah as well
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 30, 2017, 09:20:13 AM
Also isn't 36:41 for all us us because in 36:40 it says a sigh for them because the verse before that is talking about the universe so normally normally when it says a sign it's talking to all of us so when it says a sign for them is that we carried there ancestors in the ship doesn't that mean all humans so all of us came from the ark because it says a sign and the universe so for all of us if you know what I mean sorry
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 30, 2017, 09:25:04 AM
Unless 36:41 is talking about ships in general and it has nothing to do with noah's arak
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 30, 2017, 09:51:07 AM
And on 69:12 it tells us to get a lesson out of Noah PBUH and reflect on his life.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on April 30, 2017, 09:58:32 AM
36:41,Yes i do think this is about ships only. If it was Nuh A.S there would have been Hadith narrations behind it saying so,but none of that is to be found,so I think that this verse is just telling us how our ancestors immigrated.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on April 30, 2017, 01:07:13 PM
Ok so 69:12 is for the Arabs semitic people only when speaking about there ancestors but for all of us about the story that Allah saved the ancestors of the Arabs semitic people etc
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: QuranSearchCom on May 01, 2017, 12:29:50 AM
That only the Arabs and children of Israel came from the ark not all mankind is that right jazzakallah

Neither.  The flood of Noah was limited to certain people only, and not all of the earth, nor to all of the Arabs or the Middle East.  It came to limited people, perhaps a village or a group of villages:

[007:059]  We sent Noah to his people. He said: "O my people! worship God! ye have no other god but Him. I fear for you the punishment of a dreadful day!



Quote
Ok so 69:12 is for the Arabs semitic people only when speaking about there ancestors but for all of us about the story that Allah saved the ancestors of the Arabs semitic people etc

Nothing mentioned in the Noble Verse about only Arabs or semitic people.  As brother Muslim Dude said, this is an example for us.  Allah Almighty Commanded the Muslims to walk through earth and learn from the ancient people's stories:

[003:137]  Many were the Ways of Life that have passed away before you: travel through the earth, and see what was the end of those who rejected Truth.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 01, 2017, 08:51:31 AM
Assalam alikum Osama thanks I was wondering what does the verse 69:11 and 36:41 mean to you when you read them jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 01, 2017, 09:03:33 AM
But also a side note it does say in 17:3 that the children of Israel came from the ark also 7:69 says AD was the Khalifa after noah and thamud in 7:74 after AD which implies they were descendents of one of another and 11:48 says some nations that came from the ark etc sorry for not posting the verses I'm only using a mobile so it's not the best devices sorry but anyway yea what does 69:11 and 35:41 mean too you jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 02, 2017, 07:46:22 PM
Any thoughts Bro on what you think 69:11 means to you Bro jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: QuranSearchCom on May 02, 2017, 09:22:12 PM
Wa Alaikum As'salam,

The people of Prophet Noah, peace be upon him, were all wiped out except a few of them.  How few and how many of them survived only Allah Almighty Knows.  But this doesn't mean that all of the people in the region were wiped out.  The flood was limited only the people of Noah as I showed above (http://www.answering-christianity.com/blog/index.php/topic,2575.msg12187.html#msg12187).


[007:069]  "Do ye wonder that there hath come to you a message from your Lord through a man of your own people, to warn you? call in remembrance that He made you inheritors after the people of Noah, and gave you a stature tall among the nations. Call in remembrance the benefits (ye have received) from God: that so ye may prosper."

The bloodline of Noah, peace be upon him, was a blood line of Prophets and the chosen people of GOD Almighty.  And Allah Almighty made the Jews kings over people in status and closeness to Allah Almighty:

[005:020]  Remember Moses said to his people: "O my people! Call in remembrance the favour of God unto you, when He produced prophets among you, made you kings, and gave you what He had not given to any other among the peoples.


Notice "when He produced prophets among you".  So the bloodline of Noah, peace be upon him, is a bloodline of FAITH and PROPHETS.  Ordinary Jews, who got mixed with many nations, do not have that bloodline in their biology.  But in Faith, they do.  And Allah Almighty does speak about the Jews coming from many different lands to Palestine in the End of Times:

www.google.com/#q=site:answering-christianity.com+17:104
www.answering-christianity.com/dajjal.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/666.htm




Prophet Noah and the Numerical Miracles:

It is also worth mentioning that Prophet Noah in the Glorious Quran IS THE CORNER STONE of the entire Mighty Miracle of the number 19 Miracle in the Glorious Quran.  You can thoroughly see this with 1000s of examples at:

www.answering-christianity.com/100_percent_guarantee_that_quran_is_divine.htm


I hope this helps, insha'Allah.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 03, 2017, 10:06:39 AM
Thanks jazzakallah and just that last verse 69:11 what does this verse mean to you sorry to bother you its just this us the main verse and maybe verse 36:41 what do these 2 verses mean to you jazzakallah in your opion
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 04, 2017, 09:24:38 AM
Also some say 17:3 means all of us because it uses offspring not they were the seed so some say when it says offspring it's like say o children of Adam so it sounds like all but I know that's not the case so how do we explain this verse and also what does 69:11 and 36:41 mean too you jazzakallah sorry yo keep getting on your nerves it's just I'm trying to understand that's all see where I come from there are not a lot of muslims and we don't have a teacher and the mousque only opens Friday for jummah jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: AMuslimDude213 on May 05, 2017, 05:43:34 AM
Surah Isra,Verse 3 says Zooriyah Min in Arabic,which translates to Offspring of them,those or offspring of one,it doesn't say offspring.
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: pascoe on May 05, 2017, 03:44:23 PM
Ok so pickthall was right when he translated it too they were the seed instead of offspring jazzakallah
Title: Re: 36:41 noah and flood
Post by: QuranSearchCom on March 15, 2018, 04:39:45 PM
As'salamu Alaikum Everyone,

Also visit this link: www.answering-christianity.com/blog/index.php/topic,3101.msg15425.html#msg15425 .

Take care,
Osama Abdallah