Author Topic: Doubting Thomas said "My Lord and my God" to Jesus. Yet, Moses and Believers....  (Read 7004 times)

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Offline QuranSearchCom

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As'salamu Alaikum dear brothers and sisters,

I thought I should start sharing with you my upcoming articles' notes so that you would know what I am currently working on from my big que of tasks:


THE DOUBTING THOMAS:

-  Doubting Thomas said "My Lord and my God" to Jesus.  Yet, all believers were called "God", and Moses was the "God" of the Believers, Aaron and Pharaoh:

Moses was called "The God" (Exodus 7:1) of the Believers, Aaron and Pharaoh.  Jesus said he was greater than Moses.  Thomas, the Disciple, called Jesus "My Lord and my God" (John 20:28).  Jesus denied to be GOD Almighty.  All Believers were called "GODS and Sons of GOD" (Psalm 82:6) in the Bible.  "GOD" in the Bible also means master, leader, priest.  Therefore, the doubting Thomas' statement didn't suggest that Jesus was his Creator.  And Jesus being a "God" doesn't mean that he is GOD Almighty.  He is just another mere "God" like the rest of the believing creations and nothing more.  For ample more details, visit:

www.answering-christianity.com/godtitle.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/convert_christians.htm
www.answering-christianity.com/son_of_god.htm



-  Doubting Thomas called Jesus "My Lord and my God".  Did he call Jesus the Creator of the Universe?  What does "God" here mean?  Does it mean that Jesus is GOD Almighty, the Soverign LORD and Creator of everything?

   -  Moses was called the "God" of Aaron and the believers.
   -  Moses was called the "God" of Pharoah.
   -  Jesus said that he is greater than Moses.
   -  Why should it be a surprise that Jesus is a "God" (god)?
   -  The Bible says about the believers:  "Ye are all gods, and ye are all sons of GOD".
   -  Many have Godly names.  For example, Gabriel means STRONG GOD.
   -  Also Melchizedek in the Bible had no beginning and no end, and no father and no mother.  The Bible says that Jesus had to be in ACCORDING TO Melchizedek.  So Melchizedek was also a "God", and Jesus was a "God" in according to this Jews' "God", Melchizedek, who was also the Jews' Highest Priest.
   -  Jesus said that:
      -  Only GOD Almighty Knows when the Hour will come.  No one knows it including Jesus himself.
      -  Why do you call me "Good".  No one is Good except GOD Alone.
      -  Hear O Israel, the LORD our GOD, the LORD is One.
      -  I can't do anything of my own initiative.
      -  If I bear witness of myself my witness will not be True.  This is very important because in the Bible, you need at least two witnesses for any testimony.  But for GOD Almighty, no witness is required, because He is the ULTIMATE TRUTH and WITNESS.  GOD Almighty needs no witness.  So Jesus' statement here clearly says that he is not the Creator.
      -  Also, the "God" (theos) was used to others in the Bible, including to satan himself.  So Jesus being Thomas' Theos doesn't mean that Thomas meant it to be that Jesus is the Creator, nor when Jesus accepted this title from Thomas that Jesus accepted that he is the Creator.  After all, Jesus had always denied being anything worthy of even considering if he were to be without GOD Almighty.  So Jesus clearly isn't GOD Almighty.


JESUS IS GOD'S SLAVE:

The following are only a few quick examples from the 10s (tens) that exist in the Old Testament:

-  "Servant" in the Old Testament, is it the same as "Slave"?

Slave and Servant are the same word in the Old Testament:
http://biblehub.com/lexicon/exodus/21-20.htm
http://biblehub.com/lexicon/exodus/21-2.htm
http://biblehub.com/hebrew/5650.htm


Jesus was called GOD's Abad (slave) in the Old Testament:
http://biblehub.com/lexicon/zechariah/3-8.htm
http://biblehub.com/lexicon/isaiah/52-13.htm



ISLAM:
   -  Does "God" title refute Islam since Islam doesn't give titles of "God" and "Son of God" to creations?

      -  Allah Almighty in the Glorious Quran recognized the "Sons of GOD" title, and He also addressed it.
      -  So the believers being given these titles before Islam wasn't something anti-Islamic.
      -  Every religion had Its own Covenant and Law.  The Covenant of Noah for example was different from the Covenant of Moses.
      -  Islam's Covenant isn't into the "Son of GOD" and "God" (god) titles, because the disease of idol worship and all of the falsehoods that evolved from it, all the way to trinity, required for GOD Almighty to reset all of this mess and to restore the ORIGINAL FAITH, ISLAM, where GOD Almighty is ONE and there is NONE LIKE UNTO HIM (this is in the Glorious Quran and throughout the previous scriptures).

      -  So Islam discontinuing the use of "son of GOD" and "god" titles is valid, because Islam came to restore the Original Faith.  "Rab" is still being used today, which means Master and it is used for both human-masters such as husbands and fathers, and also used for GOD Almighty.

      -  It's ok to have a creation-rab, but do not elate him to the dangerous level of shirk (associating partners with Allah Almighty), because shirk is an unforgivable sin if you die on it.  Such shirk practices would include getting blessings from your creation-rab, and getting Divine inspirations and guidance by calling unto him, and elating him to a status of you being below him, and he being spiritually above you.  Also bowing to him would lead to shirk.


ADDITIONAL MATERIAL:

http://www.answering-christianity.com/john20_28.htm
https://www.google.com/#q=site:answering-christianity.com+DOUBTING+THOMAS


I will put the detailed article together, soon Insha'Allah.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah
     

Offline Tahmeed

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Re: Upcoming new article: Doubting Thomas calling Jesus "God"....
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2015, 04:08:45 am »
Walaikums salam dear brother,

Are you sure Allah permitted the title 'Son of God'? Because look at this verse.

(Sura Mai'dah 5:18) (Both) the Jews and the Christians say: "We are sons of Allah, and his beloved." Say: "Why then doth He punish you for your sins? Nay, ye are but men,- of the men he hath created.."

First, why does Allah say that 'Nay, ye are but men'? The Jews and Christians never say they are begotten children of God nor do they think that they are more than human because of being 'sons of God'.

Actually, Allah Himself explains in the verse the reason behind the Jews' and Christians' calling themselves sons of God. "We are sons of Allah, and his beloved.- So they use this title to mean that they are beloved of God. But yet Allah accuses them. Doesn't that mean using the title 'Son of God' is blasphemy (let alone the title 'God'), no matter what you mean by that.

Also brother, verse 21:26 actually refers to angels.

[Ambiya 21:26-29] And they say: "(Allah) Most Gracious has begotten offspring." Glory to Him! they are (but) servants raised to honour. They speak not before He speaks, and they act (in all things) by His Command. He knows what is before them, and what is behind them, and they offer no intercession except for those who are acceptable, and they stand in awe and reverence of His (Glory). If any of them should say, "I am a god besides Him", such a one We should reward with Hell: thus do We reward those who do wrong."

Also, if we say that Allah permitted the terms 'God' and 'Son of God' before, but prohibited it because of it's danger of shirk, that would mean He was not aware of the danger when He permitted it (Nauzubillah, indeed Allah is All-knowing, Wise). Though it is also possible that He permitted the term 'son of god' to test them (i.e. whether they cross the limit or not, which they did), and finally prohibited it for us, like art and music, which were permitted before. But, the term 'son of God' is much more serious than art and music!

I am not trying to refute you dear brother, just trying to discuss. It's indeed a serious matter. So could you please clarify the things I have shown?

Allah Hafiz,
Tahmeed
« Last Edit: July 04, 2015, 04:10:06 am by Tahmeed »

Offline QuranSearchCom

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Re: Upcoming new article: Doubting Thomas calling Jesus "God"....
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2015, 10:03:39 am »
As'salamu Alaikum dear brother Tahmeed,

Here is what Allah Almighty Said in the Glorious Quran:

"And they say: "(God) Most Gracious has begotten offspring." Glory to Him! they are (but) servants raised to honour(The Noble Quran, 21:26)"

"O children of Israel, remember my favour wherewith I have favoured you, and that I have preferred you before all nations(The Noble Quran, 2:122)"


There was a time when the Jews were the only Muslims on this earth, in the Sight of Allah Almighty.  And according to their scriptures, they used to be called "BENI ELOHIM (Allah-im)" (or the people of GOD).  Ben or Bin also mean son of, as in OSAMA BIN LADEN, or Prophet Muhammad, peace be upon him, came from BENI HASHIM (tribe of Hashim in Mecca).  So Beni Allah is where the confusion began.  It was no more than an earthly metaphor that later turned into a trinity.  It kept evolving to ridiculous levels.  Islam came to restore the Original Faith and to end this metaphor and to give its real and original meaning, because it is not original.  I would also imagine that the remnants of the People of Noah (peace be upon him), after the flood, were also called SONS OF GOD or BENI ALLAH, because there was none other to directly guide them besides Allah Almighty, especially after the terror of the Great Flood.  Also in Heaven, we will all be the People of Allah Almighty living directly under Him, and speaking directly to Him, and getting our Guidance directly from Him, the Almighty.

So people were called "Sons of GOD" in the past.  The Holy Quran blasphemes the ones that use this title in a literal sense for Eesa (Jesus), peace be upon him.  But as the Noble Verses above say, the metaphoric sons of GOD (Beni Allah in the Hebrew scriptures) were believers raised to Honor.

I hope this helps, Insha'Allah.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah


Offline QuranSearchCom

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Re: Upcoming new article: Doubting Thomas calling Jesus "God"....
« Reply #3 on: July 04, 2015, 10:24:19 am »
And thank you dear brother, Tameed.  I certainly need this back and forth brainstorming so that the article would be air-tight solid from its first version.  We need to thoroughly expose the blasphemy of trinity and all other shirks (partnering with Allah Almighty) and idol worship, Insha'Allah (if Allah Almighty is Willing).

May Allah Almighty bless you!  Ameen.

Take care,
Osama Abdallah

Offline submit

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Re: Upcoming new article: Doubting Thomas calling Jesus "God"....
« Reply #4 on: July 04, 2015, 10:36:17 am »
the Jews view themselves as beloved ones by God . Thus the reason them being called children of God explicitly. The Israelite scriptures indicate the mercy of God onto Israelites as His children so that they become example to other nations, as the people of covenant, and they are His treasure. Unfortunately the Jews do not kept their covenant even after many chances and hope given.

Quote
Deut 14
1 Ye are the children of HaShem your G-d: ye shall not cut yourselves, nor make any baldness between your eyes for the dead.
2 For thou art a holy people unto HaShem thy G-d, and HaShem hath chosen thee to be His own treasure out of all peoples that are upon the face of the earth..

Christians on the other hand view themselves as Children of God as well just like Jews as God is compassionate to mankind.
As for Son of God. Adam was referred as Son of God but it is not the same for Jesus since its about 2nd God that manifested on earth to do a suicidal act for sake of humanity. Post suicidal act, humans will get to see that what the 2nd God did on earth was all about Love bearing the sins of all.