Author Topic: Confusion!!!!  (Read 67907 times)

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Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #15 on: November 02, 2013, 09:32:04 AM »
''Who made the earth firm to live in,made rivers in its midst,set thereupon mountains immovable.''(SURAH-Al-Naml:61)


 Can anyone explain this verse

Hopefully this will help:

Allah says:

أَمَّن جَعَلَ الْأَرْضَ قَرَارًا

Is He [not best] who made the earth (ard) a stable ground (Qararan)...


The two key words used in this verse are أرض (ard) and قَرَارً (qararan).

According to:
1. Arabic-English Lexicon by Edward William Lane p.85
2. Hans Wehr Arabic-English Dictionary, 4th Edition p.16
3. Al-Mawrid Arabic-English Dictionary p.75
4. The Students Arabic-English Dictionary by Francis Joseph Steingass p.28
5. A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran by John Penrice p.5
6. Arabic-English of Quranic Usage p.25
7. Vocabulary of the Holy Quran p.14
8. Arabic-English dictionary by J.G.Hava p.7
9. Dictionary Of The Holy Quran, by Malik Ghulam Farid, M.A p.17
10. Google Arabic-English & English-Arabic translator

أرض (Ard) means:
1. Land
2. Earth
3. Ground
4. Soil
5. Terrain

According to:
1. Arabic-English Lexicon by Edward William Lane p.
2. Hans Wehr Arabic-English Dictionary, 4th Edition p.881
3. The Students Arabic-English Dictionary by Francis Joseph Steingass p.826
4. A Dictionary and Glossary of the Koran by John Penrice p.116
5. Arabic-English of Quranic Usage p.750-751
6. Vocabulary of the Holy Quran p.493-4
7. Arabic-English dictionary by J.G.Hava p.587
8. Dictionary Of The Holy Quran, by Malik Ghulam Farid, M.A p.686-7

قَرَارً means:

1. Abode, place of abode, an abode
2. dwelling, secure dwelling
3. place where one resides
4. a resting place
5. Settledness
6. firmness
7. solidity
8. steadiness
9. stability
10. repose
11. rest
12. habitation
13. residence
14. resting place
15. security
16. a fixed or secure place
17. repository
18. to settle down
19. container
20. secure place
21. it settled
22. became firm
23. steady
24. a state, time or place of fixed abode or settledness
25. establishment


The Earth fulfills all these meanings. It is a place of rest/abode/habituation etc. The Earth is a stable, safe, secure, firm,steady, solid place for us to live.  Some planets are gaseous so they are not a fixed/stable/safe abode. Whereas the earth is not gaseous meaning that it is solid and firm. Also every-time we walk on the earth, the earth doesn't shake or fall apart. It is a stable ground. etc

وَجَعَلَ خِلَالَهَا أَنْهَارًا

 and placed within it rivers

There are rivers on the earth.

وَجَعَلَ لَهَا رَوَاسِيَ

and made for it firmly set mountains

The word رَوَاسِيَ is plural of راسية . It means Firm mountains.


So it means Allah put firm mountains in the earth. Meaning you cannot just pluck them out of the Earth.

Immovable is an incorrect translation. Cant find immovable in any Arabic dictionary that i own.

Hope this helps.

Offline abdullah

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #16 on: November 02, 2013, 05:21:56 PM »
Assalamualykum brothers.
Brother Thatmuslimguy I read you article and mashallAh it's good. I noticed that you still haven't written on the ayah about the earth moving from its place. The verse could be referring to the orbit of the earth in that the earths orbit is finely tuned and the earth stays within its orbit.
Brother farhan daha doesn't mean egg, but that doesn't matter, the Quran still says that Allah yukawer(coils) the night over the day which is only possible on a round earth.

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #17 on: November 02, 2013, 05:39:35 PM »
Assalamualykum brothers.
Brother Thatmuslimguy I read you article and mashallAh it's good. I noticed that you still haven't written on the ayah about the earth moving from its place. The verse could be referring to the orbit of the earth in that the earths orbit is finely tuned and the earth stays within its orbit.
Brother farhan daha doesn't mean egg, but that doesn't matter, the Quran still says that Allah yukawer(coils) the night over the day which is only possible on a round earth.

WalaikumAsalam,

I havnt finished the blog yet. Ive still to write about Qararan and others.

As for the other verse the arabic says two things:

1. Allah grasps the heavens and the earth lest it cease to exist/fall into destruction
2. Or Allah grasps the heavens and the earth lest they move from there fixed courses/paths. Implying that the earth has an orbit.

Brother Osama talks about it on his site and he translates it as this, with the two meanings:

It is God Who sustains the heavens and the earth, lest they stray from their fixed paths and fall into complete destruction: and if they should stray, there is none - not one - can sustain them thereafter: Verily He is Most Forbearing, Oft-Forgiving.

So yeah speaking about the fine tuned Earth is good masha'Allah.
Stay tuned hehe.

Offline FARHAN_UDDIN

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #18 on: November 06, 2013, 01:04:27 PM »
Assalamualykum.

 "We have built above you seven strong (heavens) and placed a blazing lamp.''Sura 78, verses 12-13

Brother, what's the meaning of the above verse? Does it say ,Sun is above the Seven heavens and it is a single entity? Well It's not possible. because every star and planet is in the lowest heaven and according to Nasa there are hundreds of sun like stars and some are even more brighter and larger than our Sun.


sura 71, 15-16:
"Did you see how God created seven heavens one above an other and made the moon a light therein and made the sun a lamp?"


 And in the above verse, is Quran  saying that there is only one moon and one sun in the Heavens?

 Some like to claim that Quran says stars are in the lowest Heaven while the Sun and Moon are above the Seven heavens. How should we answer them?

They quote the following verses to support their claim:


"We have built above you seven strong (heavens) and placed a blazing lamp.''Sura 78, verses 12-13

-sura 71, 15-16:
"Did you see how God created seven heavens one above an other and made the moon a light therein and made the sun a lamp?"

And why Does Allah always say earth and the heavens? By this does it mean that Earth is just as large as heaven?Is there any verse saying Earth, Sun , Moon and Stars are in the lowest heaven? And does Quran say anything about multiplicity of Sun and Moon?
« Last Edit: November 06, 2013, 01:31:54 PM by FARHAN_UDDIN »

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #19 on: November 06, 2013, 02:17:06 PM »
post failed
« Last Edit: November 06, 2013, 02:41:22 PM by ThatMuslimGuy »

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #20 on: November 06, 2013, 02:28:16 PM »
Continued:

This verse states that the Stars, the sun and the Moon are all in the same heaven. And what heaven are the stars in? The lowest as the Quran says:

 

وَلَقَدْ زَيَّنَّا السَّمَاءَ الدُّنْيَا بِمَصَابِيحَ

 

Transliteration:

[067:005]  Walaqad zayyanna alssamaa alddunya bimasabeeha

Interpretation and Meaning:

Saheeh International:

[067:005]  And We have certainly beautified the nearest heaven with stars

Muhammad Al-Hilali & Muhsin Khan:

[067:005]  And indeed We have adorned the nearest heaven with lamps

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2013, 02:34:51 PM »
.... post failed
« Last Edit: November 06, 2013, 02:40:52 PM by ThatMuslimGuy »

Offline FARHAN_UDDIN

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2013, 02:37:29 PM »
Thanks for your clarification.

 Okay, Allah said:


 "We have built above you seven strong (heavens) and placed a blazing lamp.''Sura 78, verses 12-13

Brother, what's the meaning of the above verse? Does it say ,Sun is the only lamp in the Universe. Well that can't be true as we know there are hundreds of stars much brighter and larger than our sun. Please clarify this.

 And, Does Quran say there is only one moon and one sun? Is there any verse talking about the multiplicity of the Sun and the Moon?

 

 

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2013, 02:40:18 PM »
Quote
Update from Osama Abdallah: The Message Board does not accept some of the special characters.  It will cause for your post to get cut.  The special character of left and right SINGLE QUOTE from MS-Word, for example, will cause for the post to get cut when that character is found.  The same with the special character of DOUBLE QUOTES from MS-Word.  Characters such as the following will cause for the post to cut from where they're found: .   Read more...

I am very sorry for the trouble, dear brother.  Please always save your work in Wordpad before you post any post on this board.  Please visit the link that I gave above for more details.


Omg just wont let me copy and paste my stuff. Ill just copy it on my blog.

here it is:

http://quran-errors.blogspot.com/2013/11/for-farhan.html

"And does Quran say anything about multiplicity of Sun and Moon? "

We only have one sun and one moon. The sun we see during the day. The moon we see at night.

"And why Does Allah always say earth and the heavens?"

There wasnt a word for universe back then. So to speak about the Universe the best thing would to say Samma Wa Ard. The heaven and earth.

Basicly everything above and below. E.g. The universe.
« Last Edit: December 11, 2013, 04:14:39 AM by QuranSearchCom »

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #24 on: November 06, 2013, 02:47:16 PM »
Thanks for your clarification.

 Okay, Allah said:


 "We have built above you seven strong (heavens) and placed a blazing lamp.''Sura 78, verses 12-13

Brother, what's the meaning of the above verse? Does it say ,Sun is the only lamp in the Universe. Well that can't be true as we know there are hundreds of stars much brighter and larger than our sun. Please clarify this.

 And, Does Quran say there is only one moon and one sun? Is there any verse talking about the multiplicity of the Sun and the Moon?

It wouldn't let me upload full response. So ive put it online.

Its a simple verse saying Allah made 7 heavens. And placed in it a blazing lamp. Which is obv refering to the sun.

No Stars are described as lamps too. Read about here:

http://quran-errors.blogspot.com/2013/10/re-wikiislam-scentific-error-in-quran.html

The Stars create their own light according to the Qur'an

The Quran says:



37:6

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37:6
Sahih International
Indeed, We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment of stars
Muhsin Khan
Verily! We have adorned the near heaven with the stars (for beauty).
Yusuf Ali
We have indeed decked the lower heaven with beauty (in) the stars,-
Shakir
Surely We have adorned the nearest heaven with an adornment, the stars,



67:5

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وَلَقَدْ زَيَّنَّا السَّمَاءَ الدُّنْيَا بِمَصَابِيحَ
Sahih International
And We have certainly beautified the nearest heaven with stars...
Muhsin Khan
And indeed We have adorned the nearest heaven with lamps...
Yusuf Ali
And we have, (from of old), adorned the lowest heaven with Lamps...
Shakir
And certainly We have adorned this lower heaven with lamps...

Here the Quran describes the stars as lamps. Lamps produce there own light and heat. Thus the Quran accurately describes the light of stars.

So the stars are lamps too.

Allah describes both the stars and the sun as lamps. Showing that they the same thing. They are only made as a distinction because we dont say look at the star when we are on about the big blazing thing in the sky. We say Sun. Its how language works.



25:61

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تَبَارَكَ الَّذِي جَعَلَ فِي السَّمَاءِ بُرُوجًا وَجَعَلَ فِيهَا سِرَاجًا
Sahih International
Blessed is He who has placed in the sky great stars and placed therein a [burning] lamp...
Muhsin Khan
Blessed be He Who has placed in the heaven big stars, and has placed therein a great lamp (sun)...
Yusuf Ali
Blessed is He Who made constellations in the skies, and placed therein a Lamp...
Shakir
Blessed is He Who made the constellations in the heavens and made therein a lamp...

71:16

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 وَجَعَلَ الشَّمْسَ سِرَاجًا
Sahih International
 ...and made the sun a burning lamp?
Muhsin Khan
...and made the sun a lamp?
Yusuf Ali
...and made the sun as a (Glorious) Lamp?
Shakir
...and made the sun a lamp?

Offline FARHAN_UDDIN

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #25 on: November 06, 2013, 03:05:51 PM »
Blessed is He who has placed in the sky great stars and placed therein a [burning] lamp...

 Brother, is the above verse differentiating sun from other stars and branding it as the only burning lamp? As I have told you earlier there are hundreds of stars more brighter  and bigger than our sun. And can you please explain me in detail the verses where Quran says Stars emit their own light just like the Sun?  And is there any verse describing multiplicity of the Moon?

 Thanks for clearing up 80% of my confusion.

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #26 on: November 06, 2013, 05:08:47 PM »
Blessed is He who has placed in the sky great stars and placed therein a [burning] lamp...

 Brother, is the above verse differentiating sun from other stars and branding it as the only burning lamp? As I have told you earlier there are hundreds of stars more brighter  and bigger than our sun. And can you please explain me in detail the verses where Quran says Stars emit their own light just like the Sun?  And is there any verse describing multiplicity of the Moon?

 Thanks for clearing up 80% of my confusion.

not worked again read online here my respone:

http://quran-errors.blogspot.com/2013/11/for-farhan-2.html

Offline FARHAN_UDDIN

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #27 on: November 12, 2013, 07:46:38 AM »
''God there is no god but He, the Living, the Everlasting. Slumber seizes Him not, neither sleep; to Him belongs all that is in the heavens and the earth. Who is there that shall intercede with Him save by His leave? He knows what lies before them and what is after them, and they comprehend not anything of His knowledge save such as He wills. His Throne comprises the heavens and earth; the preserving of them oppresses Him not; He is the All-high, the All-glorious.''(2:255)


 What does it mean by ''... His Throne comprises the heavens and earth...''? Allah The Most Merciful says His throne comprises the Heavens and Earth, but comprises the Heavens means also the Earth as earth is in the heavens. Isn't it? Why Allah differentiates between Earth and Heavens in the above verse?
« Last Edit: November 12, 2013, 08:20:30 AM by FARHAN_UDDIN »

Offline ThatMuslimGuy

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #28 on: November 12, 2013, 04:37:48 PM »
''God there is no god but He, the Living, the Everlasting. Slumber seizes Him not, neither sleep; to Him belongs all that is in the heavens and the earth. Who is there that shall intercede with Him save by His leave? He knows what lies before them and what is after them, and they comprehend not anything of His knowledge save such as He wills. His Throne comprises the heavens and earth; the preserving of them oppresses Him not; He is the All-high, the All-glorious.''(2:255)


 What does it mean by ''... His Throne comprises the heavens and earth...''? Allah The Most Merciful says His throne comprises the Heavens and Earth, but comprises the Heavens means also the Earth as earth is in the heavens. Isn't it? Why Allah differentiates between Earth and Heavens in the above verse?

AsalamuAlaikum,

It appears to be a weak translation. When i checked others it says extends.

Sahih International
Allah - there is no deity except Him, the Ever-Living, the Sustainer of [all] existence. Neither drowsiness overtakes Him nor sleep. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on the earth. Who is it that can intercede with Him except by His permission? He knows what is [presently] before them and what will be after them, and they encompass not a thing of His knowledge except for what He wills. His Kursi extends over the heavens and the earth, and their preservation tires Him not. And He is the Most High, the Most Great.
Muhsin Khan
Allah! La ilaha illa Huwa (none has the right to be worshipped but He), the Ever Living, the One Who sustains and protects all that exists. Neither slumber, nor sleep overtake Him. To Him belongs whatever is in the heavens and whatever is on earth. Who is he that can intercede with Him except with His Permission? He knows what happens to them (His creatures) in this world, and what will happen to them in the Hereafter . And they will never compass anything of His Knowledge except that which He wills. His Kursi extends over the heavens and the earth, and He feels no fatigue in guarding and preserving them. And He is the Most High, the Most Great. [This Verse 2:255 is called Ayat-ul-Kursi.]
Yusuf Ali
Allah! There is no god but He,-the Living, the Self-subsisting, Eternal. No slumber can seize Him nor sleep. His are all things in the heavens and on earth. Who is there can intercede in His presence except as He permitteth? He knoweth what (appeareth to His creatures as) before or after or behind them. Nor shall they compass aught of His knowledge except as He willeth. His Throne doth extend over the heavens and the earth, and He feeleth no fatigue in guarding and preserving them for He is the Most High, the Supreme (in glory).
Shakir
Allah is He besides Whom there is no god, the Everliving, the Self-subsisting by Whom all subsist; slumber does not overtake Him nor sleep; whatever is in the heavens and whatever is in the earth is His; who is he that can intercede with Him but by His permission? He knows what is before them and what is behind them, and they cannot comprehend anything out of His knowledge except what He pleases, His knowledge extends over the heavens and the earth, and the preservation of them both tires Him not, and He is the Most High, the Great.


The Arabic term used is wasi'a which means extends.

(2:255:41)
wasiʿa
Extends
[http://corpus.quran.com/wordmorphology.jsp?location=(2:255:41)]

Looking up Hans Wehr Arabic-English Dictionary and others it means the same thing. Extends.

Hope this clears up the confusion.

Offline FARHAN_UDDIN

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Re: Confusion!!!!
« Reply #29 on: November 15, 2013, 03:26:49 PM »
Assalamualykum

 http://media.isnet.org/off/XIslam/IslamOnline/orbit.html


Please refute the above article. It says verses regarding sun and moon are not miracles

 

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