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Prophet Mohammed(pbuh) was the Messiah predicted in OT and anticipated by jews

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Mohammed.Rashid:
Sorry to say this but ur points too poor to prove ur theory and I honestly doubt that u r a muslim. Dont worry- If u r not its fine we  can continuing discuss on this topic.

Prophet Mohammed pbuh is not the,this or that Messiah does not proves that Islam is a false religion.
Nor does it matters to muslims if he was the messiah the jews awaited or not.

AND IF U R MUSLIM I APOLOGISE TO UR ABSURD THEORY OF MESSIAH AND  I AM SORRY TO SAY THAT
U DONT WANT TO COME THEM TOWARDS ISLAM. HOW, LET ME SAY IT WHY AND HOW.

I by writing on this topic wanted u to show the path that messiah is a term which christians hardly know about.
What it is, what he will do or what he did. If u hate muslim vs muslim then y u bothered to reply .
MY INTENTION WAS - IF ONLY THEY KNEW ABOUT IT THEY WILL INSHA ALLAH COME TO THE  PATH OF TRUTH I.E., ISLAM - IS THE REASON I WROTE THIS ARTICLE. BECOZ IT IS HIDDEN BY THE SCHOLARS OF CHRISTIANITTY

THE JEWS BELIEVE AND THE BIBLE TOO SAYS THAT MESSIAH WILL COME FROM AMONG THE JEWS FOR THE JEWS AND TO THE JEWS ONLY  ONLY .

How - Read it from the mouth of jesus of the bible.
Jesus of bible himself accepted it when he said 
Jn 4:22 You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews

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No doubt ,Abdullah ibn salam believed that Mohamed (pbuh)was a true prophet from God,but who said that he believed in him as the davidic king messiah prophecised in the tankah? would you quote the man ,plz?

REPLY :- davidic king messiah - r u joking? I already wrote and had proven that jesus himself denied that the
messiah they were expecting will not descend from david when he said is y he said Mt 22:41-46 - if messiah were to be his son - then y wud king david calls him my lord.

Please read it again with understanding

If u r muslim the Scholars do accep that bible(Greek for books) or whatever u like to callim prophet Mohammed pbuh was
not we have today - Aleppo codex some claim Codex Sinaiticus  & Codex Amiatinus,Vaticanus .Prophet pbuh pre-dates them by many years.

If u r not - then Recently Dr. Daniel Wallace claims that so and so manuscript is oldest. Remember ITS JUST A CLAIM.

I dont understand how many times I need to say that MESSIAH IS NOT A UNIQUE TERM.
SO R U REALLY NOT GETTING MY POINT OR U DONT WANT TO BELIEVE IT.

NOR ANYWER IN THE TANAKH(OT) IT IS MENTIONED THAT HE WILL BE A UNIQUE MESSIAH. IS IT ? THEN
SHOW ME . AND EVEN IN NT - NOWERE JESUS SAYS THAT I AM THE UNIQUE MESSIAH.

A UNIQUE PROPHET YES - IT IS GIVEN TO MOSES PBUH -
DT 34:10 THERE HAS NOT RISEN IN ISRAEL A PROPHET LIKE UNTO MOSES

A muslim asking where had sahibi said so and so.- this again makes me doubt ur claim of being a muslim.
Dont worry I can still prove my point on messiah.

U r asking me for the proof that where has sahibis claimed that Mohammed pbuh is the messiah.
Yet u cannot prove to me thru ur quoting of john 4:25 that jesus is A UNIQUE MESSIAH david king or whatever.

But let me prove - By: Prof. Mahmoud Esmail Sieny
Many historians of religion have pointed out that prophecies were made by the Prophets in the Old Testament and by Jesus Christ in the Gospels about the coming of Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). The Bible had in fact detailed descriptions for Prophet Muhammad (pbuh). This fact is clearly stated in the Qur’an which says that the Jews “know him (Muhammad) as well as they know their own children….” In the life story of many early converts like Salmaan Al-Farisi we have historical testimony to this fact. For ti was their knowledge of the coming of Muhammad (pbuh) in Arabia (knowledge they learned from pious monks in Iraq and Syria) that made them leave their own homelands in those parts of the world and journey to the deserts of Arabia. And at Makkah and Medina those lucky seekers of truth were fortunate to meet Muhammad (pbuh) the awaited Messiah or Prophet. -  U can read the complete article by him here - http://www.islamunveiled.org/eng/modules.php?name=News&file=print&sid=113

If u are a muslim then u must believe that Quran has  said that Jews do know Him as they know their own sons.
Surat Al-'An`am [verse 20] - Those to whom We have given the Scripture recognize it as they recognize their [own] sons.

Who else can jews know like their own sons - No doubt that it was none other than or a unique prophet the messiah
awaited by them from the time torah predicted him in Dt 18:18. I WILL RAISE UP A PROPHET NOTE IT IS WRITTEN PROPHET NOT MESSIAH.

More about the sahabi abdullah ibn salam
http://www.onislam.net/english/reading-islam/about-muhammad/his-companions/450551-abdullah-ibn-salam-a-man-from-the-people-of-para.html
http://www.islamreligion.com/articles/4703/viewall/


ONE IMP QUESTION I WANT TO ASK U?
IF HE OR ANY NON-MUSLIM WUD HAVE BELIEVED OR MENTIONED THAT HE WAS THE DAVIDIC-KING MESSIAH - WUD U HAVE BELIEVED HIM TO BE TOO?

ALSO, EVEN A JEWISH RABBI - SIMEON BEN YOHAI SAID THAT THE MESSIAH WILL ARRIVE FROM AMONG THE ISHMAELITES
REMEMBER HE PREDATED PROPHET MOHAMMED PBUH.

AND ONE MORE MENTIONED JACOB BIN NATHANEAL.

NOW I HAD GIVEN U A MUCH BETTER REASON TO BELIEVE THAT HE WAS THE MESSIAH. TELL ME WILL U BELIEVE
ONE HIM TO BE ONE NOW.

IF U R A MUSLIM U JUST TO PROVE UR POINT WHICH HAS NO WEIGHTAGE. U R JUST DOING IT TO SATISFY UR EGO. SORRY THIS IS  WHAT I THINK. I APOLOGISE IF UR INTENTION IS SOMETHING ELSE BUT ONLY IF IT IS A GOOD ONE.

Let me tell u that y jesus was never d unique messiah which u claim he was.
The answer is simple - HE DIDNT FULFILLED ANY PROPHECY which old testament predicted or u can say chosen people wanted him to fulfill.

QURAN - WHOM ALLAH GUIDES NO ONE CAN LEAD HIM ASTRAY

Now I will not reply - if u go on repeating the same thing again and again. Read it with understanding try to understand what i want to say. First try to understand the basic thing what my article focuses on then if i think u have some good point then only i will reply. As i have no time to waste.

QURAN - OUR DUTY IS ONLY TO CONVEY(THE MESSAGE)

Egyptian:
Alaikom assalam Brother Osama ,and thanx for your link .... 

no muslim would ever deny that the prophet peace be upon him is mentioned in the torah and Injeel,as the prophet like unto Moses peace be upon him....  and the discussion in the thread is not debating that at all ...

take care ..May Allah bless you..



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--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---Prophet Mohammed pbuh is not the,this or that Messiah does not proves that Islam is a false religion. Nor does it matters to muslims if he was the messiah the Jews awaited or not.
--- End quote ---


That is true ... TO ADD, Nor does it matter to NON-muslims if he was the messiah the Jews awaited or not,if he never claimed to be so.



--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM --- AND IF U R MUSLIM I APOLOGISE TO UR ABSURD THEORY OF MESSIAH .
--- End quote ---

I don't have a theory regarding the messiah , the messiah for me is none.


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---
MY INTENTION WAS - IF ONLY THEY KNEW ABOUT IT THEY WILL INSHA ALLAH COME TO THE  PATH OF TRUTH I.E., ISLAM - IS THE REASON I WROTE THIS ARTICLE.  ..
--- End quote ---

I'm sure of your good intentions, but  remember:

Holy Quran 16:125 Call unto the way of thy Lord with wisdom and fair exhortation, and reason with them in the better way.

I don't find it wisdom to call non-muslims to Islam with the incredible claim that Mohamed peace be upon him is such so called awaited Davidic jewish king messiah.

I don't believe in "the means justify the ends"
 

--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---

THE JEWS BELIEVE AND THE BIBLE TOO SAYS THAT MESSIAH WILL COME FROM AMONG THE JEWS FOR THE JEWS AND TO THE JEWS ONLY  ONLY . .How - Read it from the mouth of Jesus of the bible. Jesus of bible himself accepted it when he said   Jn 4:22 You Samaritans worship what you do not know; we worship what we do know, for salvation is from the Jews

--- End quote ---

You have just provided one of the reasons Jesus couldn't be the messiah(as predicted in the tankah) ....   
the messiah as depicted in the tankah would be FOR the Jews ,not AGAINST them.





--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---I already wrote and had proven that jesus himself denied that the messiah they were expecting will not descend from David when he said is y he said Mt 22:41-46 ...Please read it again with understanding
--- End quote ---

1- and I say the same ,Please read the previous link (I linked before) about Mathew's misinterpretation of the psalm, again with understanding.

2- more important ,let's for the sake of argument suppose that ,Jesus denied that the Davidic messiah is the seed of David ,on the other hand,the original prophecies in the tankah says he must be from the seed of David,,, what does it mean?
I think in that case we have only two options:

A-either the prophecy of the old testament is true "the messiah as the seed of david",hence giving the lie to Jesus of the new testament.

B- or the prophecy of the old testament is faked, hence we are left with the dramatic conclusion(If there were no prophecy ,there were no fulfillment)..



--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---If u r muslim
--- End quote ---

I'm.


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---NOR ANYWER IN THE TANAKH(OT) IT IS MENTIONED THAT HE WILL BE A UNIQUE MESSIAH. IS IT ? THEN SHOW ME .
--- End quote ---

the incredible specific prophecies regarding such so called messiah would make him clearly unique ... as he is said to make dramatic incredible above imagination changes in the world(something that never and will never happen).




--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM --- 
A UNIQUE PROPHET YES - IT IS GIVEN TO MOSES PBUH -
DT 34:10 THERE HAS NOT RISEN IN ISRAEL A PROPHET LIKE UNTO MOSES
--- End quote ---

Prophet Mohamed "pbuh" is like unto Moses (at least we Muslims believe so)....


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM --- 
A muslim asking where had sahibi said so and so.- this again makes me doubt ur claim of being a muslim.
--- End quote ---

I said that Abdullah ibn salam believed that Mohamed (pbuh)was a true prophet from God not the davidic messiah, and you doubt me being muslim !!! ,strange,isn't it?!!



--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---   u cannot prove to me thru ur quoting of john 4:25 that jesus is A UNIQUE MESSIAH david king or whatever..
--- End quote ---


my point was to prove that the Jews(correctly) differentiated between the promised messiah and the prophet like unto Moses....



--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM --- Who else can jews know like their own sons - No doubt that it was none other than or a unique prophet the messiah awaited by them from the time torah predicted him in Dt 18:18. I WILL RAISE UP A PROPHET NOTE IT IS WRITTEN PROPHET NOT MESSIAH...
--- End quote ---


once you omit the part in red ,I agree with you 100% then... and thank you for your note "IT IS WRITTEN PROPHET NOT MESSIAH."


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---

ONE IMP QUESTION I WANT TO ASK U? IF HE OR ANY NON-MUSLIM WUD HAVE BELIEVED OR MENTIONED THAT HE WAS THE DAVIDIC-KING MESSIAH - WUD U HAVE BELIEVED HIM TO BE TOO?...
--- End quote ---

I won't believe ,reason? because neither he nor anyone else fulfilled ANY of the prophecies mentioned about him in the tankah.  but again ,repeating you correct words (Prophet Mohammed pbuh is not the,this or that Messiah does not proves that Islam is a false religion,Nor does it matters to muslims if he was the messiah the jews awaited or not.)


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM --- 
Let me tell u that y jesus was never d unique messiah which u claim he was.
--- End quote ---

I never said he was.


--- Quote from: Mohammed.Rashid on March 19, 2014, 04:56:44 PM ---
Now I will not reply

--- End quote ---

I hope you do for a short while till I make a final concluded post , showing how the old testament REALLY depicts the messiah ,and why such depiction is against the holy Quran itself.


Mohammed.Rashid:
FACE PALM

Egyptian:


The awaited Messiah according to the old testament?

 He is simply the one who is supposed to generate the arrival of heaven on earth.

He is?

A king that will be descended from King David (Isaiah 11:1) via Solomon (1 Chronicles 22:8-10, 2 Chronicles 7:18.

Mohamed (pbuh) is not descended from King David neither Jesus (pbuh).  so neither of them qualified to be such messiah.


supposing (wrongly) the Jesus of the new testament or whatever person claims that the messiah can't be from the seed of David ,is wholly without merit ,as when it comes to prophecy fulfillment what does matter ,is what the original prophecy says, not what you force it to say...


Once he comes?


He will provide the Jews and the whole world with every good thing imaginable and erase every bad thing imaginable too "a real paradise on earth".


2- The Jewish people will experience eternal joy and gladness

Isaiah 51:11Those the LORD has rescued will return. They will enter Zion with singing; EVERLASTING JOY will crown their heads. Gladness and joy will overtake them, and sorrow and sighing will flee away.


The mission of Mohamed or Jesus (pbuh)ended the Jews suffering offering them eternal joy?!!!

exactly the opposite ,their sufferings were doubled,with no EVERLASTING JOY,as the prophecy claims. 


3- There will be no more hunger or illness, and death will cease

Isaiah 25:8He will swallow up death for all time, And the Lord GOD will wipe tears away from all faces, And He will remove the reproach of His people from all the earth.



No comment !!!


3- The peoples of the world will turn to the Jews for spiritual guidance !

Zechariah 8:2323 This is what the Lord Almighty says: “In those days ten people from all languages and nations will take firm hold of one Jew by the hem of his robe and say, ‘Let us go with you, because we have heard that God is with you.’”


Had that been fulfilled?!!!!!!!!!  Imagine after the mission of Islam the people asking the Jews for spiritual guidance !!!!!



4- ONE CREED AND ONE RELIGION !!!

Isa, 66:23 ("And it shall come to pass, that from one new moon to another, and from one sabbath to another, shall all flesh come to worship before me, saith the Lord") .Psalm 86:9 ("All nations whom thou hast made shall come and worship before thee, O Lord; and shall glorify thy name"), Isa. 11:9 ("...for the earth shall be full of the knowledge of the Lord, as the waters cover the sea")


Not only it is the impossible dream to make all people believe in one religion,but also it is against the quran teachings ...which clearly teaches that believe and disbelieve is remaining till day of resurrection...eg;

Holy Quran 5:14 And with those who say: "Lo! we are Christians," We made a covenant, but they forgot a part of that whereof they were admonished. Therefor We have stirred up enmity and hatred among them till the Day of Resurrection, when Allah will inform them of their handiwork.


Holy Quran 5:64The Jews say: "Allah's Hand is tied up ." Be their hands tied up and be they accursed for what they uttered. Nay, both His Hands are widely outstretched. He spends (of His Bounty) as He wills. Verily, the Revelation that has come to you from Allah increases in most of them their obstinate rebellion and disbelief. We have put enmity and hatred amongst them till the Day of Resurrection. Every time they kindled the fire of war, Allah extinguished it; and they (ever) strive to make mischief on earth. And Allah does not like the mischief-makers.

getting the whole world into one religion is nothing but a wishful thinking.....


not finished yet........  more in next post


TO BE CONTINUED

Mohammed.Rashid:
One last time - Read my article completely and try to understand wer all ur points r covered.Dont copy paste it from anywer.

Sorry but u have no new points as it all has been already answerd.



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