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Topics - Idris

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As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

I have not participated in this forum for long time.

I just want to tell you about a very interesting details which would be - as I think - a factual confirmation of the view that Prophet Mohammed (SAAW) is mentioned in Isaiah 29:12. I find this new discovery as a welcome support for Muslim interpretation.

Muslims for a long time have seen Isaiah 29:12 as an allusion to Prophet Mohammed's (SAAW) first revelation which was given by Gabriel (AS) in the cave Hira. Indeed, a very suggestive description is given by Isaiah, pointing to the first experience which according to the Muslim tradition occurred in this place.

There is a certain word which appear in the text of Isaiah 29:12 to which Muslims did not paid attention, since it was "obscured" under the translation. It seems that this word was originally understood as a proper name for a geographic location.
Moreover, I found a further confirmation from two patristic authorities that the one who was giving this book to the "unlettered one" is the Holy Spirit which in Islam is non other than Gabriel himself (AS). As biblical scholars has also observed, the motif of "creating human from clay" is a part of the chapter 29 which thematically fits the story of al-'Alaq.

I will discuss here insha'Allah this finding, but in return I would need some help from you.

As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

brother Osama you are not responding anymore on my messages (here on private box as well as on messenger). Can you tell me why ? You said last time that you're sick, but as I noticed you are active in the forum here. Please, give me a sincere answer. Just tell me brother what I did wrong. I will not be offend and insha'Allah you will find me forbearing/understanding.

Take care,

As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh dear brothers,

one of my debater says that the Quran has some ortographical errors, and this is supposedly recorded in hadith, but he did not remember exactly. He only said that this error is connected with sin and sad, and it is related to Zaid ibn Sabit (probalby one of the companions). Do anyone recognize this hadith ? I will need a rebuttal for that case.

Jazaka Allah khayran brothers


As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

dear sisters and brother, I was told that the arabic din Kamil - which means in Arabic "Perfect Religion" or "Complete Religion" - is a very broad and general notion, and thus one have to be careful with Arab rhetoric.

First, did Prophet Mohammed (pbuh) ever called or suggested in some reliable hadith that Islam is a perfect religion (din kamil) ?
Second, if he did, the how it was understood this Arabic expression and which would be the best translation ?

Dear brother Osama, could you chekc for me in Lisan al-Arab whether this Arabic expression din kamil was used to describe Islam.

Jazaka Allahu kayran akhi Osama


Salam aleikum,

I have found in the following Old Testament quotation: "Arabia has not yet met its threshold, and "and the time of her harvest shall come." (Jeremiah 51:33)

Where did the word Arabia appear in this verse ? It is about Babylon here not Arabia. I think this is an error to mention Arabia in Jeremiah 51:33, but maybe I'am wrong.

GENERAL TOPICS | BOARD ANNOUNCEMENTS / Do they found Dajjal's Island ?
« on: October 26, 2016, 04:39:50 PM »
As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

An interesting video in Arabic talking about Dajjal. There is an image in this video (turn from 1:20 min) which shows some Island. Is this a real Dajjal Island ? What do you think ?


As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

two days ago, while browsing the contents of Hebrew books in Google I came across an interesting document which is called Zohar (perhaps some of you did heard about it before since it is commonly known in Jewish literature). The author of the original work was a 2nd-century Rabbi named Shimon bar Yohai. Generaly speaking, this work include a commentary on the mystical aspects of the Torah and scriptural interpretations as well.

I simply typed in Hebrew נביא אחמד בישעיהו (i.e. prophet Ahmed in Isaiah) and it suddenly showed up to me a 1559 edition of Zohar by Vicenzo Conti.

עלך ותאנא מאי דכתיב שוש אשיש בה' בעהיק יומין אחמד דהא הוא חדוותא ישעיה ס נדכלא 'האבא בשעחא דאתנלי תאי אורחא דדיקנ'ד עתיק יומין כלחו מארי

The text however, is writen in difficult and obscure way (even scholars has observed). There is an abvious error in בעהיק where ת was wrongly mistook as ה

You can put this Hebrew text into Google translator if you wish.


Unfortunately, I ’am not able to understand all of the Hebrew text, since as I've said it is written in a difficult way, but I can recognize the words: כתיב (it is written), בה' בעהיק יומין (through/by him in ancient of days), אחמד (ahmad), ישעיה (Isaiah), and כלחו (sent ?). Now, it is interesting to note that the two expressions תיק יומין in the entire Old Testament appears only in Daniel 7:9 and 7:13 in connection with the Son of Man (literally = ben Adam = Son of Adam) who was to be presented before the Throne of God. It can be only prophet Mohammed (pbuh) and no one else! So, the fact of using such specific words standing together is a curious indication that could reveal the shocking truth behind this Zohar book which according to some scholars is the same book that was disappeared 1,800 years ago, and after long time was discovered in Spanish in 13th cent.

Sounds exciting isn't ? For this reason I have asked a Rabbi Ben Abrahamson to help us explain what the text says, I'am waiting for his answer.

Also, if you type מחמד (Mohammed) it will suprisingly show one result, and it is in ספר דברים (Deuteronomy) ! Subhanallah!

The natural reaction of a typical Jew or Christian who hates any relationship with Islam and Prophet Mohammed (pbuh) in their scripture will be that: he will try to disprove the authenticity of any document which can testify to the prophethood of Mohammed and reliability of his advent from the Bible in general. Perhaps that’s why aroused so much controversy around this document between Jewish and Christian scholars. Those who dislike Islam, when read this Zohar book, begin to understand that these words אחמד and מחמד makes a danger allusion to the Arabic names Ahmed and Mohammed, and they are afraid that in the near future some Muslim will find it. It is quite possible.

I will write more about this topic insha'Allah when I'll get new info.

Take care, and salam
Ahmed (Poland, Warsaw)

As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

Yesterday I came across some website which at the first glance appears to be Islamic, but when you start to read its contents you will notice weird statements they made there. For example, its author asserts in the article linked below that Jesus (pbuh) according to the Quran was not raised into heaven, waiting there until he will be permissed to return to the earth (as it is commonly believed by most Muslims), but rather he was put on the cross and survived (which means that he was not actually crucified, nor killed), he concludes that Jesus died by natural death here on earth! It seems crazy for me, but what do you think brothers ?


As-Salam aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

How to explain that there is no non-Islamic testimony about the existence of Mekka in old times except only from the Greco-Egyptian geographer Ptolemy in the mid-2nd century A.D., who mentioned a place Makoraba, but even here it is not certain whether this allusion indeed referred to Mecca, as he only mentioned the name in passing (I know that many historians have said that Prolemy mentioned Mekka naming it as Makoraba, but it does not satisfy me)
Do we have some early, historical report which can prove that Mekka existed before Christian era ?

Actually I have found an obvious proof, but I need first to know how Muslims explain almost completely lack of evidences dealing with the historicity of Mekka.

As-salam aleykum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

What doest it mean the arabic word muqatal-ullah ? Does it mean "one who fight in the cause of Allah" or rather "antagonist of Allah" ?

As-Salamu aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

I was thinking that it will be a good idea to create a topic in which everyone can put some links to useful books which might help our Muslim brothers and sisters in their study on Islam and debates with Christians and Jews alike. For this occasion, I would like to share with you some nice books which will insha'Allah help you increase your knowledge about the history of Islam, Quranic preservation, its miracles. In order to help our Muslim brothers and sister who defends Islam, I will put also here some interesting and rare books written by Christian scholars and historians about the Bible, Church history etc.

For easier searching of particular book, I will mark every added section by its own color (i.e. GREEN COLOR topics dealing only with Quran, Islam, Muhammad pbuh etc., BLUE COLOR topics dealing only with Bible, Christianity, Jesus etc. RED COLOR general topics dealing with comparative religion)


Book #1 (English)
Title of the book: Variant of readings of the Quran: a critical study of their historical and linguistic origins
Author: Ahmad Ali al-Imam

This fascinating and important book attempts to investigate the nature of the seven Ahruf in which the Qur’an has been revealed and the reason for the variations in readings among the Qurraa of the Quran. It studies, examines, and discusses: the revelation of the Qur’an in the seven ahruf concluding that they represent seven linguistical ways of recitation; the compilation of the Quran during the lifetime of the Prophet and the preservation of the Quran in the memories of the Companions as well as in written form, the compilation during the time of Abu Bakr, and the further compilation during the time of Uthman; the problem of naskh to demonstrate the completeness and trustworthiness of the Quran and that no verses are missing or were read and abrogated by naskh al-tilawah either with or without hukm; the Uthmanic masahif and their relation to the seven ahruf; the language of the Quran and whether it includes one, several, or all the dialects of the Arabs; the origin of the qiraat and conditions governing accepted readings; and ikhtiyar (i.e., the selection of one reading rather than another) and the rules governing the Qurraa’ who selected a reading.


Book #2 (English)
Title of the book: Introduction to the principles of Tafsir
Author: Sheikh ul'Islam Ibn Taymiyyah, Muhammad Bin Salih Al-Uthaymin, translated by Ahsan Hanif

This book is one of the many written on the topic of Quranic tafseer. In it, the renowned author Shaykh al-Islam Ibn Taymiyyah outlines the principles employed by the scholars in understanding the verses of the Qur’an. What makes this book unique is the fact that it is combined with Shaykh Ibn Uthayman’s detailed explanation of the original text. So, the reader benefits from both the original work and the detailed explanation of the work, all in an easy to follow, smooth, accessible format.


Book #3 (English)
Title of the book: The Quran and the orientalists
Author: Muhammad Mohar Ali

The present work gives in a compact and integrated form the main orientalist assumptions and theories about the Qur’an and examines them critically. The treatment is not what some of the orientalists are prone to call “apologetic”. The Author has met them on their own grounds and have taken up their arguments and statements one by one, pointing out their faults, inconsistencies and untenability, dealing with each and every one and examining them with the facts and logic. It has been demonstrated how and where they have erred and drawn wrong conclusions. It has also been shown that in advancing their theories and assumptions they have in almost all cases distorted and misinterpreted the texts and the facts, often resorting to biased shaping of the latter and a good deal of arbitrary assumptions and surmises. The treatment is clear, concise, to the point, logical, and effective. The Qur’an and the Orientalists takes in to account the views and assumptions advanced about the Qur’an by the dozens of the orientalists of the nineteenth and twentieth centuries like William Muir, Theodor Noldeke, David Margoliouth, Arthur Jeffery, Richard Bell, Montgomery Watt, and others. These views are analyzed and discussed in three broad parts. In the first part are discussed those that constitute a direct allegation of the Prophet’s authorship of the Qur’an, particularly, his alleged borrowing from Judaeo-Christian sources, the question of his literacy and the alleged environmental influence on him in general. In the second part are dealt with those that revolve around the question of the Qur’anic wahy (revelation) and are aimed at showing that the Qur’anic revelation proceeded in some form or other from the mind and personality of the Prophet, thus supplementing the allegation of his authorship. In the third part it is discussed those that relate to the history and text of the Qur’an, particularly Noldeke’s theory about the history of the text of the Qur’an, Arthur Jeffery’s “Materials” for the history of the text of the Qur’an, the Bell-Watt theory of revision of the text of the Qur’an, the fiction of the foreign vocabulary of the Qur’an, J.A. Bellamy’s supposed copyist’s errors and proposed emendations of the Qur’an and the like, together with a survey of the orientalists’ translations of the Qur’an.


Book #4 (English)
Title of the book: The History of The Qur'ānic Text: From Revelation to Compilation
Author: Muhammad Mustafa al-Azami

The Qur'an reigns supreme in Muslim hearts as the most sacred of texts: a profusion of exalted ideas to rouse the mind, noble histories to stir the soul, universal truths to awaken the conscience and precise injunctions directing humanity to its own deliverance, all distilled into the melodious essence that is the Word of Allah. Through fourteen centuries Muslims have persevered in championing the text against corruption, memorising its every word and contemplating its every phrase, so that in our own times untold millions have enthusiastially committed each letter to heart. Beginning with a catalogue of ancient and contemporary attacks on the Qur'an, this expansive book provides unique insights into the holy text's immaculate preservation throughout its history, as well as exploring many of the accusations levelled against it. The reception of divine revelations, Prophet Muhammad's role in teaching and disseminating these verses, the text's compilation under his guidance and the setting of its final external shape shortly after his death, are meticulously and scientifically examinded alongside such topics as the origins of Arabic, its palaeography and orthography, the so-called Mushaf of Ibn Mas'ud, and the strict methodology employed in assembling textual fragments. By way of comparison the author investigates the histories of the Old and New Testaments, relying entirely on Judaeo-Christian sources including the Dead Sea Scrolls and uncovers a startling range of alterations that touch almost every fact of the Biblical Scriptures. Using this as a springboard for assessing Western theories regarding the Qur'an, he makes a sophisticated yet passionate case for questioning the aims of Western scholarship in continuously undermining Islam's holy book, and illustrates convincingly that such research, motivated by more than mere curiousity, has no scientific bearing on the Qur'an's integrity.


Book #5 (English)
Title of the book: The Perfect Guide to the Sciences of the Qurān, Tom 1
Author: Imam Jalal-al-Din Abd al-Rahman al-Suyuti, translated by Professor Hamid Algar, Dr. Michael Schub and Mr. Ayman Abdel Haleem

Imam Jalal-al-Din `Abd al-Rahman al-Suyuti (849--911 AH / 1445--1505 AD) was born, lived and was buried in Cairo. The ascription `al-Suyuti' is a reference to Asyut, a town in Upper Egypt from which his family hailed. Known as the `son of books' from the numerous books he studied and referred to in his works, he could equally be called the `father of books' because of the many books he produced

From his early years, al-Suyuti devoted his life to learning, reading, writing and teaching, holding notable positions in those fields in the city of Cairo at a time when it was the centre of Islamic learning par excellence. He was an outstanding scholar, second to none in the field, of Quranic Sciences (`Ulum al-Qur'an), in which he produced many well-known works. However, being the all-round scholar that he was, his contributions covered almost all the fields of Arabic, the Qur'an, the Traditions (hadith) and History. His works were of such superb quality that they earned him the respect of his generation and the generations that followed to the present day. Most important of these in the field of Quranic Sciences was his al-Itqan. The work found its way to many circles both near and far in the Islamic world. It was first published in the years 1271, 1278, 1279, 1306, 1317 and 1318 AH, in two volumes, but the translation presented here is of a publication of four volumes published in 1987 AD (1967 AD). The translation at hand is of the first volume. Al-Itqan is perhaps the most outstanding work of its kind in the field of Quranic Sciences. Exhaustive in its sources and its subjects, thoughtfully and lucidly written, the work is also well arranged. Readers will be taken by the depth, breadth, scope and mastery of the author while noting how much Muslim scholars have devoted to the study of the Qur'an and how varied and diverse were the fields in which those studies were made. A must to the specialist of Quranic Studies, the work is highly recommended to the initiate


The original work of Jalal-al-Din al-Suyuti
Title of the book: al-Itiqan fi ulum al-Quran


Book #6 (English)
Title of the book: The Qur'an in its Historical Context (Routledge Studies in the Qur'an)
Author: edited by Gabriel Said Reynolds

Providing commentary on the controversial revisionist school of Qur’anic studies, this book explores the origins, scholarship and development of the Qur'an. The collection of articles, each written by a distinguished author, treat very familiar passages of the Qur’an in an original manner, combining thorough philology, historical anthropology, and cultural history. This book addresses in a critical fashion the hottest issues in recent works on the Quran. Among other things, the contributors analyze the controversial theories of Luxenberg regarding Syriac and the Quran, and in particular his argument that the term Hur refers not to virgins but to grapes.


Second part of the book
Title of the book: New Perspectives on the Qur'an: The Qur'an in its Historical Context 2 (Routledge Studies in the Qur'an)
Author: edited by Gabriel Said Reynolds


I will add insha'Allah other books.

Take care, and salam
Ahmed (Poland, Warsaw)

As-Salamu aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

Is anybody familiar with Lisan al-Arab in this forum ? Maybe brother Osama ? I 'am looking for a particular fragment which was translated in English as follows:

"Ya’qub says, ‘Bakkah is what is situated in between the two mountains of Makkah, because the people crushed one another during the circumambulation or overcrowded there. (…). It is said that Bakkah is the name of the interior of Makkah and it was given this name due to the crowding and swarming of the people. The tradition of Mujahid states, ‘Bakkah is among the names of Makkah.’ And it is said, ‘Bakkah is the site of the House of the Lord, and Makkah is the whole of the city.’ It is also said, ‘Both [Makkah and Bakkah] are the names of the city; and [the alphabetical letters] “B” and “M” succeed (can replace) one another."

The author that quoted this fragment refers to Lisan al-‘Arab, Beirut: Dar Sadir, 1955-1956 (15 volumes), vol. 10, p. 402. 

But, I 'am specifically using an older edition of Lisan al-Arab from 1883 (20 volumes) which is available here:


I’ve tried to find this passage, but I could not, it seems the way searching in Lisan al-Arab differ from a typical arabic dictionaries.
Can someone help to identify this fragment and tell me which volume, which page ? Jazakum Allahu khayran

Take care, and salam
Ahmed (Poland, Warsaw)

GENERAL TOPICS | BOARD ANNOUNCEMENTS / Kaffir version of the Bible ?
« on: February 18, 2016, 06:57:56 AM »
As-Salam Aleikum wa rahmatullahi wa baraketuh,

I came across an interesting article in a Christian sources.

Kaffir Version Of The Scriptures

The Kaffir is spoken by the Kaffres (q.v.), and was reduced to writing by the Reverend W.B. Boyce, a Wesleyan missionary, who, in connection with the Reverends Wm. Shaw and W.J. Shrewsbury, commenced in 1830 a translation of the Scriptures, which was completed in the course of four years. This translation, however, formed but the basis of that eventually published, and it was not till 1841 that, after a very careful revision, the New Test. was published. A vigorous revision was again undertaken, and in 1845 the revised New Test. was published, which was used by all the missionaries laboring among the Kaffre tribes. A new and again carefully revised edition of the New Test. was completed in 1854 at the Mount Coke Wesleyan mission press, and in 1859 the entire Old Test., after a careful revision, was completed at press. In 1865 the committee of the British and Foreign Bible Society announced that the revised Kaffir Bible, which had been slowly progressing for some time under the editorial supervision of the Reverend J.W. Appleyard, was completed and ready for circulation.
The features of this revised edition were, that "very laborious efforts have been made to render the work an accurate and faithful translation of the Hebrew and Greek texts; and the proficiency of Mr. Appleyard in the knowledge of the Kaffir language, combined with great critical care, afford every reasonable guarantee that this version of the Holy Scriptures will prove correct, intelligible, and idiomatic, and in all respects admirably adapted to the people among whom it will now circulate. Its appearance, after long and earnest expectation, will be hailed with peculiar satisfaction by all missionaries laboring where the Kaffir language is spoken." In 1869 the report of the British and Foreign Bible Society again announced that the translation of this Bible was about to undergo revision:  "A board of revisers, which consists of representatives of the various churches in South Africa, has been formed, and its labors already commenced. The difficulty here, as in so many other cases, is to make the translation idiomatic without sacrificing the exact sense of the sacred original." In 1871 the four gospels were announced as completed, and one of them was printed as a specimen, in order to elicit further criticisms, if needful, before the text is finally settled. In 1874 the board of revisers lost one of its most valuable helpers, the Reverend J.W. Appleyard, shortly after the revision of the New Test. was completed, which was issued together with the unrevised Old Test. in 1878. The revision of the Old Test. is still in progress; from July 8, 1874, to January 22, 1882, the Old Test. was revised up to Jeremiah 26. See Bible of Every Land, page 426 sq. (B.P.).

J. Mc’Clintock & J. Strong, Cyclopedia of Biblical, Theological, and Ecclesiastical Literature, vol. 12 (New York: Harper & Brothers, 1894), p. 622.

Salam Aleykom,

I was waiting for the answer on my post "The claim that Greek number 666 is a reference to ‘’In the name of Allah’’. Perhaps you did not notice, but it's OK :)

Let me share with you some very interesting informations, but first I will ask: did you heard before about the latin expression "Vicarius Filii Dei" ?

Salam Aleykom,

who is the author of the claim that the Greek inscription of 666 refers to the arabic formula "In the name of Allah" ?

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